At what Point do I ask for a new car?

[Frustration]

or different car...




So purchased a 135 vert.

CPO, Nice deal and they got my (perfect) 335 coupe...


Since purchase, I've been back 4 times (in 3 weeks).

A pillar plastic popped off
Long start and limp (fixed by software update)
Vert top sliding part gets stuck

fixed
then...
A pillar popped back off
Long start
Down on power noticably
I asked about shaking and they say "it's just the way that car rides" and honestly I'm used to it now and think it is simply vert Chasis...

Fixed but needed ret to fixthe seat belt thing.

fixed--

But they damaged leather in passengers seat... They're "looking at options"
A pIllar popped off again
car still not powered like on pick up day.
Vert top thing stuck open and then when I put the top back up, it made a cracking sound...
Long starts are intermit and didn't repeat for the dealer (and no code found this time but they found code last time)


This is BMW number 6 (fourth in a row) and I have never ben serviced this much for the same type stuff in 10 years much less 10 days (I have only used the car 10 days since purchase.



Frankly I have pretty low confidence in this car...

Did I get a good price? Sure, but it's relative to a BMW and I don't want to drive round wondering if the thing is going to work right and or fail on me and My family (in AZ heat that's a problem).

I LOVE this car. But I dread it and I dont think that's what BMW want...


Sad thing was that I've had the nick (Frustration) for a while... Never thought It would apply.

[Frustration]

I did on drop off this time...

Frankly I would pay into it, but I've been sitting here with this pit in my stomach thinking about picking that car back up.

Not the way I've ever felt about any of the past cars...


I actually stopped using this dealer for a while because service was bad, but my wife had to use em a couple of times due to location and said "they're fantastic again". So went back, was happy, bought a new car.

The service department seemed revamed top to bottom...


Then bang-bang-bang-bang.


I have no idea how this works. Do I just say "this thing is no place near acceptable" ?

[gnat]

You probably should talk to a local lawyer about the issue to find out what legal rights you may have (don't know if lemon laws apply to used cars). Once you know if you have any legal grounding or not, then talk to the dealer (if you do have legal options, I'd save that card until you know if they really want to help or not).

If there are no laws to help you out, then it will come down to the dealer themselves so trying to be as pleasant about it as possible is in your best interests. Hopefully they would see that you are a long time BMW owner and customer of theirs so it would behoove them to try to solve this, but you never know...

Sorry it's been such a pain. Best of luck trying to get it sorted out.

[Frustration]

I've purchased two others from this dealer and 2 more from across town.

I have a friend at the other dealership that suggested exactly that (talk to the sales side immediately), and the sales manager is working on it now.


There's not a 10k diff from this CPO to a new car and frankly I would spend the extra money to not have to wonder if my family are making it in this one.



I deal with problems and a$$holes al day and I really dont want to be "that guy" to the people at this dealership who clearly are good at what they do and make a pretty good name for BMW, but I just cant imagine me taking the X3 out of town and having my wife and 6 year old in this car...


The more I think about it the less happy I am (which is different than saying I'm more mad, because nobody wants this to happen obviously).

[Ash83]

Talk to a Manager at the Dealer be calm and ask him what is there plan.

Then tell him that this not your first Bimmer and this is by far the worse experience ever with a 'luxurious car' and you will bee seeking a legal consultation. Do not lose your nervous just tell them what you think and see what they will respond..

I heard a lot of story about similar CPO doomed cars and win BMW NA get involved they worked a deal with the dealer to solve the issues because they do not want to ruin there CPO program.

[Taymaishu]

Make sure you get anything in writing, too.

I found dealing with what is now considered by some to be a VERY unprofressional but huge dealership here in Sydney, you need everything in writing.

I would suggest getting a starting consultation with a solicitor and see what their thoughts are and go from there. Also you should make it clear you will be seeing a solicitor with the Dealer Principal so they know you're serious about your complaints.

[gnat]

Originally Posted by Ash83

and you will bee seeking a legal consultation

I would leave this out (regardless of it you get legal advice before or after talking to the dealer) until the situation warrants it. As soon as you start throwing around lawyers a business owner/manager has to get their legal "team" involved too just to cover their ass if they have any kind of sense. The result is that even if something could have been reasonably worked out, you've now turned it into a confrontational situation that might not have been needed.

Now if you came to them explained the problems/situation, offered a reasonable solution (and it needs to be reasonable from their side too to have the best chance of success), and they just give you the finger, then by all means play the lawyer card. This is also why I suggest getting the advice FIRST so you can calmly and immediately respond with "this is the legal advise that I've been given about the situation" rather than sounding somewhat petulant with "I'm going to talk to my lawyer about this" which most people will blow off because it rarely comes to fruition.

Originally Posted by Taymaishu

Make sure you get anything in writing, too.

+1001

[Frustration]

Good trip to the dealer... They still have my car, Acknowledged the things that have gone wrong and made sure I understood that anything from a straight fix to a different car might be the end solution but asked that we just work through it. They want the BMW rep involved and he's first going to review it electronically and then, if needed, he'll come drive it.

Very reasonable so far. We'll see when it comes to the end action required/desired...

[GoGeo]

What you just wrote should be mandatory reading for every single a-hole out there that always wants to get "their" lawyer.

There is a time and a place for attorneys but you can get so much further with politeness, understanding and honesty. If all fails, then go get "your" lawyer...

Originally Posted by gnat

I would leave this out (regardless of it you get legal advice before or after talking to the dealer) until the situation warrants it. As soon as you start throwing around lawyers a business owner/manager has to get their legal "team" involved too just to cover their ass if they have any kind of sense. The result is that even if something could have been reasonably worked out, you've now turned it into a confrontational situation that might not have been needed.

Now if you came to them explained the problems/situation, offered a reasonable solution (and it needs to be reasonable from their side too to have the best chance of success), and they just give you the finger, then by all means play the lawyer card. This is also why I suggest getting the advice FIRST so you can calmly and immediately respond with "this is the legal advise that I've been given about the situation" rather than sounding somewhat petulant with "I'm going to talk to my lawyer about this" which most people will blow off because it rarely comes to fruition.


+1001

[NewYearsBoy]

Originally Posted by gnat

You probably should talk to a local lawyer about the issue to find out what legal rights you may have (don't know if lemon laws apply to used cars). Once you know if you have any legal grounding or not, then talk to the dealer (if you do have legal options, I'd save that card until you know if they really want to help or not).

If there are no laws to help you out, then it will come down to the dealer themselves so trying to be as pleasant about it as possible is in your best interests. Hopefully they would see that you are a long time BMW owner and customer of theirs so it would behoove them to try to solve this, but you never know...

Sorry it's been such a pain. Best of luck trying to get it sorted out.

Thats what Im doing tomorrow.. I have a new 135i and I have had constant problems...

[Clap135]

Take leagal action. I settled for a large cash settlement that was five digits. Once my caw hit 49k...its gone one way or another. For the cash I got...they could service it all they want as long as I get a loaner LOL. At this point I don't care anymore.

[nobbyv]

Originally Posted by GoGeo

What you just wrote should be mandatory reading for every single a-hole out there that always wants to get "their" lawyer.

There is a time and a place for attorneys but you can get so much further with politeness, understanding and honesty. If all fails, then go get "your" lawyer...

Agreed. Clap135 clearly falls into the "other" camp...

[MikeinAlexandria]

A certified Pre-owned BMW should be just like a new one. There is about a $2500 premium because the BMW shop goes through a mutlipoint inspection and fixes everything on the car. If you keep having trouble, I would probably get the dealer to just buy the car back from you and look for a different one. Unless you are completely in love with the car, in which case I would call BMW NA weekly with updates and get them to get the car fixed correctly.

[Angry3]

Originally Posted by MikeinAlexandria

A certified Pre-owned BMW should be just like a new one. There is about a $2500 premium because the BMW shop goes through a mutlipoint inspection and fixes everything on the car. If you keep having trouble, I would probably get the dealer to just buy the car back from you and look for a different one. Unless you are completely in love with the car, in which case I would call BMW NA weekly with updates and get them to get the car fixed correctly.

A CPO BMW is a used car that's reconditioned to a certain standard, nothing more, and it's highly unlikely the dealer will agree to buy the car back.

IMHO there's likely no point in thinking lawyer here, though dropping a couple hundo for an initial consult can't hurt. Other than a couple of states that have very limited buyer protections for used cars the LL simply isn't an option, and it sounds like the dealer is at least trying to get the car fixed right which kills any MM Warranty Act claim.

Dealers will give a lot of lip service to making you happy, but when push comes to shove they aren't going to take this car back and eat their profit on the deal unless the OP has the leverage to make them (which I'm almost certain he doesn't).

I'm assuming the OP reviewed the CPO checklist, warranty claim, service, and vehicle histories before he bought the car and that it checked out. If that's so, approach them reasonably and see what they'll do. Most likely the best case scenario is they will offer to trade the OP out of the car and into another one at his expense. At that point it's just a matter of money and how bad the OP wants out of the car.

Good luck, hope things work out for the best.

[Frustration]

The OP didnt have the car for 24 hours before the problems started and the service manager has been very up front with what could have changed in drivability etc after they fixed the code, Long start etc...

Good point on researching that car ahead of purchse and it brings another point to surface.

Had the cars work history included all of the things that are wrong with this vehicle now and are documented, there is absolutely no way I would have purchased it.


The dealership has done a great job of handling this so far and I told them I would be willing to work on a few solutions. I'm not going to ask for things that I would feel are unreasonable. I think they should take responsibility and make things right and I am willing to help with dollars...


I could be wrong, but I think they'll work it out.

I think a lot of the things here on the forum are about unfair and unreasonable owner expectations...


We'll see.

[Frustration]

As a follow up, do we have a resource for calling BMWNA?

I wont have an answer to my request from the dealership until Tues at the earliest (and I am traveling that day) but would like to support the dealer in their request to have BMW NA support the reconcilliation...

GOT IT!

Thanks for the PM

[Frustration]

OK, long story short....


I had to bend a little and so did the dealership.

I know this is a place where the sense of self-worth can be a little exagerated by some, so anything other than a new car for the bad one will be be getting screwed, but...


I had to devalue my deal a little and spend some money. I dont fully like the final solution and think I paid into this a litte more than I should have...

But I think the outcome was fair.


Bottom line, I'll pick up a 2011 vert today.



Quick note to the folks at the dealership, This deal doesn't happen and goes to attorneys if it were not for a stellar service department during all of the trips back and forth. It was there effort and attitude and the work of the floor sales person that made up for literally the worst sales manager I have ever dealt with at any dealership, much less a premium brand.



If not for the working level people, this would have been my last BMW.

[gnat]

Congrats on a resolution that sounds at least acceptable if not perfect. Hopefully the new car will be much less of a hassle for you.

If the sales manager was that much of an issue, I would suggest you write a very detailed letter to both BMWNA and the owner of the dealership (assuming it's not the sales manager). Make sure to be clear about the parts you are happy about as well as the parts that will make you think twice before buying from that dealer (or BMW) again. Also try to write it with as little personal feeling/passion as possible.

[pinmagic]

And you can bet your sweet bippy that the sales manager is already lining up another customer for that car.

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by pinmagic

And you can bet your sweet bippy that the sales manager is already lining up another customer for that car.

So very true.