How reliable is a stock block / stock internals 700-800whp build?

[MuffinFlavored]

What's gonna go first on a build like that? I am amazed by how far this platform has come and am toying with the idea of picking up a $900-$1,200/mo M3 lease then doing some nice mods to it.

I'm just curious what the chances of blowing your engine / breaking something at 700-800whp are.

[Sales@KRATOS]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

What's gonna go first on a build like that? I am amazed by how far this platform has come and am toying with the idea of picking up a $900-$1,200/mo M3 lease then doing some nice mods to it.

I'm just curious what the chances of blowing your engine / breaking something at 700-800whp are.

First and foremost you will need a good crank hub kit like the one offered from Maximum PSI. It has taken tons of abuse without fail on one of our test cars that currently produces 1163whp with our KRAS55Bi and is the crank hub kit of choice for the highest hp S55's on the market.

One other major factor you need to consider is high back pressure which can attribute to connecting rod failure. This is tremendously significant as many consumers with stock style manifold turbo upgrades were bending rods at 700whp-700+whp and were attributing these failures to rotating assembly limitations, when in fact it was due to high torque demands and high back pressure. One of our beta test vehicles has over 30k miles of hard driving and abuse with our KRAS55Bi's installed on a stock engine of which almost 10K miles of that was at 812whp daily driven on E85. The key to keeping the stock engine safe and reliable at that power level was reduced back pressure as result of our Patent Pending redesigned manifold with mathematically increased A/R ratio. Also, low torque demand is another contributing factor for safety and reliability as shown in our press releases.

That being said, the answer to your question is yes you can safely produce 700whp-800whp as long as the you have the correct supporting mods. Good luck with your build and let us know if there is any way we can assist!

[MuffinFlavored]

Originally Posted by Sales@KRATOS

First and foremost you will need a good crank hub kit like the one offered from Maximum PSI. It has taken tons of abuse without fail on one of our test cars that currently produces 1163whp with our KRAS55Bi and is the crank hub kit of choice for the highest hp S55's on the market.

One other major factor you need to consider is high back pressure which can attribute to connecting rod failure. This is tremendously significant as many consumers with stock style manifold turbo upgrades were bending rods at 700whp-700+whp and were attributing these failures to rotating assembly limitations, when in fact it was due to high torque demands and high back pressure. One of our beta test vehicles has over 30k miles of hard driving and abuse with our KRAS55Bi's installed on a stock engine of which almost 10K miles of that was at 812whp daily driven on E85. The key to keeping the stock engine safe and reliable at that power level was reduced back pressure as result of our Patent Pending redesigned manifold with mathematically increased A/R ratio. Also, low torque demand is another contributing factor for safety and reliability as shown in our press releases.

That being said, the answer to your question is yes you can safely produce 700whp-800whp as long as the you have the correct supporting mods. Good luck with your build and let us know if there is any way we can assist!

Very good post. Very impressive. KRATOS is doing some very decent marketing.

My question is, can you make a "list" of what support mods are required for a 700whp-800whp build? I don't care if it's literally a marketing list that advocates every single product your company products. You guys obviously know what you are talking about and it'd be a huge help to me (and hopefully the community as well)

[Sales@KRATOS]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

Very good post. Very impressive. KRATOS is doing some very decent marketing.

My question is, can you make a "list" of what support mods are required for a 700whp-800whp build? I don't care if it's literally a marketing list that advocates every single product your company products. You guys obviously know what you are talking about and it'd be a huge help to me (and hopefully the community as well)

We appreciate the positive feedback! The modifications list posted below is identical to what is on our 812whp stock engine S55. It's actually not a very complex mods list and doesn't require our ASR branded intakes or downpipes to achieve.

List Of Modifications

-Stock Engine
-Stock Intercooler
-ASR Downpipes
-ASR Heat Exchanger
-ASR Intake
-Spec Stage 2+ Clutch Kit (Manual Transmission) (Dodson Sportsman Plus If DCT) Recommended
-Fuel-It PI
-Maximum PSI Crank Hub Kit
-BootMod3 (HCP Custom Tune)
-KRAS55Bi Turbo System
-Pump E85

[MuffinFlavored]

Originally Posted by Sales@KRATOS

We appreciate the positive feedback! The modifications list posted below is identical to what is on our 812whp stock engine S55. It's actually not a very complex mods list and doesn't require our ASR branded intakes or downpipes to achieve.

List Of Modifications

-Stock Engine
-Stock Intercooler
-ASR Downpipes
-ASR Heat Exchanger
-ASR Intake
-Spec Stage 2+ Clutch Kit (Manual Transmission) (Dodson Sportsman Plus If DCT) Recommended
-Fuel-It PI
-Maximum PSI Crank Hub Kit
-BootMod3 (HCP Custom Tune)
-KRAS55Bi Turbo System
-Pump E85

The work you are doing is amazing, keep it up.

I was reading about valve float. Is that only an issue at the big horsepower stuff like 1k+?

Does your 800whp car have a stock exhaust system other than the downpipes?

[Sales@KRATOS]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

The work you are doing is amazing, keep it up.

I was reading about valve float. Is that only an issue at the big horsepower stuff like 1k+?

Does your 800whp car have a stock exhaust system other than the downpipes?

As always we appreciate it!

The 812whp car does currently have stock head and our ASR exhaust. However, we've made over 800whp with the just downpipes on a stock exhaust.

As far as valve float is concerned, you will run into valve float issues at the hp range you're looking to produce. You can mitigate that by adding a MILV's kit. What we found while working with Headgames was that if we had the MILV's kit installed with stock springs and increased lift, this would have created coil bind. Normally coil bind is a bad thing, however in this case the coil bind would have minimized the valve float. Either way, even with float happening our KRAS55Bi continued to climb in power on the stock block and head all the way to the 7500rpm limiter.

[guess2098]

Originally Posted by Sales@KRATOS

We appreciate the positive feedback! The modifications list posted below is identical to what is on our 812whp stock engine S55. It's actually not a very complex mods list and doesn't require our ASR branded intakes or downpipes to achieve.

List Of Modifications

-Stock Engine
-Stock Intercooler
-ASR Downpipes
-ASR Heat Exchanger
-ASR Intake
-Spec Stage 2+ Clutch Kit (Manual Transmission) (Dodson Sportsman Plus If DCT) Recommended
-Fuel-It PI
-Maximum PSI Crank Hub Kit
-BootMod3 (HCP Custom Tune)
-KRAS55Bi Turbo System
-Pump E85

How much boost does this m3 has? Thanks

[Sales@KRATOS]

Originally Posted by guess2098

How much boost does this m3 has? Thanks

This 812whp figure was achieved at 32psi on pump E85. Our goal was to limit power output to 800whp as a matter of discretion being that the engine and cylinder head were stock. However, these results were attained utilizing the previous iteration of our forged billet compressor wheel. Our latest production version compressor wheel supports an additional 10% VE over that of our previous design with no increase in lag as results have shown.

For more information on these stock engine results, please reference our previously posted press release listed below.

https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ghlight=KRATOS

[MuffinFlavored]

Originally Posted by Sales@KRATOS

This 812whp figure was achieved at 32psi on pump E85. Our goal was to limit power output to 800whp as a matter of discretion being that the engine and cylinder head were stock. However, these results were attained utilizing the previous iteration of our forged billet compressor wheel. Our latest production version compressor wheel supports an additional 10% VE over that of our previous design with no increase in lag as results have shown.

For more information on these tock engine results, please reference our previously posted press release listed below.

https://f80.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...ghlight=KRATOS

What do the torque figures look like? I'm not sure if this is true, but I believe I read you guys left torque low on your 1k whp build, as to not break any other drivetrain components?

[jpy1980]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

What's gonna go first on a build like that? I am amazed by how far this platform has come and am toying with the idea of picking up a $900-$1,200/mo M3 lease then doing some nice mods to it.

I'm just curious what the chances of blowing your engine / breaking something at 700-800whp are.

Man you’re looking at a lot of work installing and then uninstalling when you turn your lease in.

Unless you’re just looking for low payments and then buying out your lease at the end.

[MuffinFlavored]

Originally Posted by jpy1980

Man you’re looking at a lot of work installing and then uninstalling when you turn your lease in.

Unless you’re just looking for low payments and then buying out your lease at the end.

I guess I never really thought about that. That's a good point.

I have an E63S AMG now and it uh... it just ain't cuttin it. Itching for something else.

Turbos, downpipes, intake, maybe exhaust, no big deal.

Port injection, probably a big deal to take off at lease end.

Crank hub kit... let BMW keep it... you think they'd really notice?

Heat exchanger would be another thing that would probably need to come off. Clutch, let them keep it.

[nbennettksu]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

I guess I never really thought about that. That's a good point.

I have an E63S AMG now and it uh... it just ain't cuttin it. Itching for something else.

Turbos, downpipes, intake, maybe exhaust, no big deal.

Port injection, probably a big deal to take off at lease end.

Crank hub kit... let BMW keep it... you think they'd really notice?

Heat exchanger would be another thing that would probably need to come off. Clutch, let them keep it.

Not a chance they would notice it

[MuffinFlavored]

Originally Posted by nbennettksu

Not a chance they would notice it

sarcasm or no? :P

[Sales@KRATOS]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

What do the torque figures look like? I'm not sure if this is true, but I believe I read you guys left torque low on your 1k whp build, as to not break any other drivetrain components?

We set torque low on our stock engine tune for connecting rod safety and produced 812whp/676wtq on pump E85 @ 32psi with previous iteration compressor wheel.

Our built engine S55 produced 1163whp/983wtq @ 41psi on Ignite E85. However, we have been using torque reduction as well as lower boost targets for testing at the track and half mile due to traction issues as well as drivetrain preservation.

[Sales@KRATOS]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

I guess I never really thought about that. That's a good point.

I have an E63S AMG now and it uh... it just ain't cuttin it. Itching for something else.

Turbos, downpipes, intake, maybe exhaust, no big deal.

Port injection, probably a big deal to take off at lease end.

Crank hub kit... let BMW keep it... you think they'd really notice?

Heat exchanger would be another thing that would probably need to come off. Clutch, let them keep it.

If your E63s is an M177/M178, then we manufacture a turbo system for that as well. We are currently in the beta testing phase and will have a press release available on the product line next month.

Here's a sneak peak!

[nbennettksu]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

sarcasm or no? :P

lol, no, I was serious. They'd never be able to tell unless they opened 'er up.

[MuffinFlavored]

Originally Posted by nbennettksu

lol, no, I was serious. They'd never be able to tell unless they opened 'er up.

do you think tuning on a lease to this degree is dumb/a bad idea/a lot of work?

[blockdoc]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

do you think tuning on a lease to this degree is dumb/a bad idea/a lot of work?

Why not just BUY the car if you are considering so much modification? Or pick up a low mileage used and work from there

[nbennettksu]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

do you think tuning on a lease to this degree is dumb/a bad idea/a lot of work?

Actually, I think its been pretty common on this model. Two fairly easy mods are DPs and a tune, which is plenty of power to spin the hub. I think a lot of leased cars will go back with the upgraded hubs.

You can resell any of the mods you're talking about doing; on a 3 year lease, nah, its not too much.

Side note, I didn't lease this f80 like my last one, but my upgraded hub is being installed today.

[MuffinFlavored]

Originally Posted by nbennettksu

Actually, I think its been pretty common on this model. Two fairly easy mods are DPs and a tune, which is plenty of power to spin the hub. I think a lot of leased cars will go back with the upgraded hubs.

You can resell any of the mods you're talking about doing; on a 3 year lease, nah, its not too much.

Side note, I didn't lease this f80 like my last one, but my upgraded hub is being installed today.

How much did installing your upgraded hub cost you in labor?

[MuffinFlavored]

Anybody want to tell me how these prices look / what labor would look like? I couldn't find the ASR heat exhanger on Google, if Sales@KRATOS wants to throw a link or a price for the part.

Not sure if more expensive downpipes are needed, or if a more expensive tune is needed.

You're looking at about $16-$17.5k in parts shipped, then I'd imagine easily 10-20 shop hours at $100/hr = $2k?

[nbennettksu]

Originally Posted by MuffinFlavored

How much did installing your upgraded hub cost you in labor?

So, I spun my crank hub. My tech is claiming car jumped time so bmw is paying to expose canos so he can re time. I'm also not a good case study, he's my friend.

A lot of people are getting this done for 2500-2700 all in including parts.