Concerns over S65

[gatty1303]

Hello all. New member here. I currently own a 2012 boss 302 with lots of mods. I made the mistake of test driving an 08 e92 6speed the other day and pretty much fell in love.

Now I am used to great handling, and a very strong v8, as I have previously owned a 13 GT and 03 cobra. I guess the part I fell in love with is the fit and finish of the car. Light years ahead of ford. Obviously it's a luxury can and I really liked that.

That being said, I began to do a little research and all I find is the rod bearing issues! Now I understand, people won't get onto the forums and say how great their car is running, but it is everywhere. I am very familiar with fords #8 cyl issue with new 5.0's, but even that is not as prominent as these m3's with rod bearing problems.

I guess my question is, how often do these things blow? I'm sure I'm beating a dead horse and everyone is tired of hearing about it, but I didn't know who else I should ask. I do not want to buy a car and blow a 25k engine. Which is outrageous. I guess I could just buy another boss motor that's fully forged and throw it in there

Any help or guidance is appreciated!

[pbonsalb]

If you are the kind of guy who can throw built motors into cars then you can do a preventative maintenance rod bearing change.

[gatty1303]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

If you are the kind of guy who can throw built motors into cars then you can do a preventative maintenance rod bearing change.

True. But I don't consider a rod bearing change to be "preventative maintenance"

[kscarrol]

As you pointed out, it happens but we don't really know how often it occurs. There are a number of sensational stories about failures but those of us with no issues are generally silent. You hear the horror stories but not the good stories. If you want the car, get it, but only if you are comfortable with the risks. Get a CPO car or an extended warranty to CYA...

[PerfM5]

Just buy one with factory warranty or 3rd party from a dealer.

[MFL]

JFC. There's enough threads about rod bearings already.

[edwinm3]

Originally Posted by gatty1303

True. But I don't consider a rod bearing change to be "preventative maintenance"

^this

[gatty1303]

Originally Posted by MFL

JFC. There's enough threads about rod bearings already.

Yea I apologize. I know there are a lot. I do appreciate the responses tho and it makes sense to just get a warranty and not worry about it I suppose

[pbonsalb]

Is a warranty less than doing the rod bearings?

I agree rod bearings should not need to be replaced, but I was out of warranty and did not want to worry. I also could not buy any other car I wanted more for the same money I could have sold mine for.

[m3ray]

'12 Boss 302 is nothing to sneeze at. Other than fit and finish, have you found the M3 has anything performance wise which the pony car doesn't?

I am in the opposite sitaution and don't want to deal with high-priced repairs on German machines any longer. I will be opting to go American next.

[chris719]

The problem with a warranty is that there will sometimes be a fight to get them to cover it.

[gatty1303]

Originally Posted by m3ray

'12 Boss 302 is nothing to sneeze at. Other than fit and finish, have you found the M3 has anything performance wise which the pony car doesn't?

I am in the opposite sitaution and don't want to deal with high-priced repairs on German machines any longer. I will be opting to go American next.

As far as performance, no. I think the m3 is a better looking car. Fit and finish is better. I love mustangs, but all the plastic all over the place bugs me sometimes. The roadrunner motor is an absolute animal. I love the high revs and all the power. I'll try to add a pic of my car.

[Petros]

Originally Posted by gatty1303

As far as performance, no. I think the m3 is a better looking car. Fit and finish is better. I love mustangs, but all the plastic all over the place bugs me sometimes. The roadrunner motor is an absolute animal. I love the high revs and all the power. I'll try to add a pic of my car.

I'd keep the boss if i were you. Even a stock one will blow the doors off an M3. If you want some luxury, add a 328i fully loaded to your car collection. same luxury and interior as an M3, but much cheaper running costs, and no bearing issues.

[Ezio]

I had the chance to get into a 302, sat in the M3. and the rest was history. WAY better interior, and the M3 looks sexy/classy. I understand why are you lusting over a M3.

Honesty though i dont think the M3 is worth worrying over. If you want one, maybe do a rod bearing swap.

[///MPharaoh]

Don't worry about the rod-bearing issue, buy the E92 if you love it. If you can't get the issue out of your mind have a Blackstone oil analysis done to test the copper/iron levels. This can be indicative of a rod bearing issue on a used/unknown s65 motor. It's super cheap to have the oil analysis done, maybe worth it for peace of mind. Otherwise, it's around $3k to have the bearings replaced as "preventative rod-bearing maintenance."

How many miles are on the E92 you want?

[JEllis]

The bearing failures you have seen are real. That being said, even the die hard alarmists know that the failure percentages are small. The S65 is high tech and very advanced piece of machinery that does not respond well to mistreatment. Find a good one, take care of it. Sure, some babied S65s will fail, but most will be fine with proper care.

[pbonsalb]

Originally Posted by ///MPharaoh

Don't worry about the rod-bearing issue, buy the E92 if you love it. If you can't get the issue out of your mind have a Blackstone oil analysis done to test the copper/iron levels. This can be indicative of a rod bearing issue on a used/unknown s65 motor. It's super cheap to have the oil analysis done, maybe worth it for peace of mind. Otherwise, it's around $3k to have the bearings replaced as "preventative rod-bearing maintenance."

The only problem with the Blackstone test is that it is not definitive. Cars with good Blackstone tests have given up a rod.

I agree the odds are on your side that you won't have a failure. Same goes for life insurance and homeowners insurance and car insurance, but I bet you worry enough about those similar odds that you insure against them. It was not something I wanted to worry about. $10k for a used engine would be a major setback for me and you can be sure I would be doing a preventative maintenance bearing swap on that motor. That is me doing all the work. Figure on $15-20k for a shop. If that kind of money is no worry to you, then that is great.

Preventative maintenance rod bearing is $2350 parts and labor at an expensive shop like EAS in CA. You can DIY for $500 to $800 depending on what parts you use. However, it is an advanced DIY. Figure on 8-16 hours depending on how good you are, and I would not count on being on the short end of that if you are doing this job for the first time. I suspect EAS in CA, which lowers the subframe just far enough to get the pan off but no so far any hoses have to be disconnected, is doing this in 8 hours using the quicker but more expensive ARP bolts.

[Soorena]

Owner of 3 E9x M3s. The first one was an early E90 model and one of the first cars to have idle valve problem (before they launched a recall). The second one which was heavily modded was my DD and i clocked 111,000 kms in it untill i sold it to someone else. Didn't visit the dealer not even once (did the maintenance all by myself). My current E92 serves as a track car. Not a high mileage model but most of the 28,000 kms were done on track. When we opened the engine to have it built the bearings looked excellent.

As you said no one comes to forums stating how great they cars are, when shit hit the fans you see topics pop up. Just something to have in mind. Since you are looking to get a older model, i'd definitely replace the bearings to have peace in mind. It's not that much of a hard job. If you have access to a lift and know the tools and done bearing replacement before it's a weekend job with a buddy of yours.

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

The only problem with the Blackstone test is that it is not definitive. Cars with good Blackstone tests have given up a rod.

The newer cars with the revised bearings don't show anything prior going kaboom. The older ones with lead used in the bearings show a good amount of lead in the oil and that serves as a warning.

[gatty1303]

What years did bmw put in the revised bearings?

[Soorena]

Originally Posted by gatty1303

What years did bmw put in the revised bearings?

Sometimes in 2011.

[gatty1303]

Here is what I'm working with now. Love it, but would like a little more luxury lol

[edwinm3]

Originally Posted by gatty1303

Here is what I'm working with now. Love it, but would like a little more luxury lol

Nice