BMW X5 and X6 Forum 2014-Current
BMW Garage BMW Meets Register Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read


Post Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
      08-14-2013, 07:04 AM   #1
jman26
Private
United_States
29
Rep
70
Posts

Drives: 2014 X5 msport active steer
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: United States

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2015 F15  [0.00]
20' vs 19' ride comfort?

I have a x5 '14 xline on order, nov delivery. Can anyone speak to
1) how much harder the road drive/feel will be on '19 vs the stock 18
2) are the 19' all weather still just as good in snow? Am i giving up any snow traction by going to 19' all weather.

All input appreciated. Thx guys. I am a first time bmw owner to be.

2014 x5 xline
Orbit grey
Mocha dakota
Active steering
Driver asst plus
Premium
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 08:25 AM   #2
chrisny
Brigadier General
chrisny's Avatar
United_States
547
Rep
3,307
Posts

Drives: 2020 X5 40i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: NY

iTrader: (0)

I think you mean 19" not 19', unless you're buying a car with 19 foot tires

To answer your question, assuming the same suspension for both options, the 19's will have less sidewall and therefore ride a little more harsh, but it all depends on the tire size. You should be fine with 19's, it's 20's where it'll get really low profile and more harsh.

That said, if you get the adaptive drive, even the 20's should be plenty smooth.

As far as snow, the 19's, I believe but could be wrong, are no wider but do have less side wall, which also translates to a little worse in the snow, but again, 18 vs 19, I think the difference is negligible. If the 19's are actually also wider, then you lose more snow traction.

One question, out if curiosity, why the active steering without active dampers?
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 09:35 AM   #3
MysticBlue
Lieutenant Colonel
369
Rep
1,887
Posts

Drives: '20 M5C, '09 M3 DCT Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Eastern Oregon... They call 'em rigs here

iTrader: (0)

Shouldn't be any difference in snow traction between 18" and 19" all weather tires... they both suck. I know this wasn't specifically what you asked, so feel free to ignore my rant, I just bring it up for anyone who is concerned about winter traction. Last year I went from all weathers to snow and ice rated on my Dakota. Huge difference in the snow and ice. I could put it in 2wd in situations where I used to put it in 4wd and could hardly tell I wasn't in 4wd. When I get the X5, I plan on getting 20" with performance tires, and a separate set of 19" with snow and ice tires. I know not everyone wants to spend the extra money on wheels, but it makes it quick and easy to change over for winter driving, and I don't plan on ever driving on all weather tires again. A tire that tries to do everything doesn't do anything well.
But to answer your question, I don't think there will be much difference between 18 and 19 inchers. Get what you want.
__________________
M5C 20% tint, Xpel full front, partial sides and rear. Spacers, 15mm front, 12mm rear. Turner Motorsport Oil Cooler Guard.
M3: Active Autowerke filter, Dinan underdrive pulley, Dinan full exhaust and software, 3.45 Differential, Springs, Brakes, Dinan/HRE wheels, 275/30-19 w/10mm spacer, 295/30-19 w/3mm spacer, painted front reflectors, 30% tint, Escort 8500i & Lidar Jammer, LUX H8 V5 halos, Euro rear foglights, 3M ClearBra.
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 09:45 AM   #4
chrisny
Brigadier General
chrisny's Avatar
United_States
547
Rep
3,307
Posts

Drives: 2020 X5 40i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: NY

iTrader: (0)

Have to agree with Mystic Blue and actually meant to mention the advantage of true winter tires as well. If you can afford a second set, dedicated winters are always better if you have any concerns at all about winter weather, and dedicated summers are always that much better in warmer weather. So I agree, get what you want/like, budget permitting.
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 12:50 PM   #5
jman26
Private
United_States
29
Rep
70
Posts

Drives: 2014 X5 msport active steer
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: United States

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2015 F15  [0.00]
Chrisny & mysticblue. Thank you for the input. I will stick with the "19 and yes I'm not driving a mknster truck.

My understanding is the active steering helps make the car more agile in parking lots ets an tightens up on the hwy. What/why do I need active damper also for this reason. I am a novice here so please elingthen me.

Both your humor on the all season is noted and chuckled at.
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 01:43 PM   #6
chrisny
Brigadier General
chrisny's Avatar
United_States
547
Rep
3,307
Posts

Drives: 2020 X5 40i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: NY

iTrader: (0)

Active steering doesn't make it more agile, the active damping (adaptive drive) does. Active steering tightens up the steering feel (amount of effort required) when cornering and loosens for low speed driving (parking lots etc).

The active damping refers to the actual suspension. When in sport, stiffens up the suspension for better handling and softens when in comfort for better ride quality. There is more to the active damping though, it is constantly evaluating the road to give the best balance between ride quality and handling.
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 04:02 PM   #7
Patarix
Enlisted Member
4
Rep
38
Posts

Drives: Bmw X5 30d
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Panama - Rep of Panama

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisny View Post
Active steering doesn't make it more agile, the active damping (adaptive drive) does. Active steering tightens up the steering feel (amount of effort required) when cornering and loosens for low speed driving (parking lots etc).
Hello Chrisny,

It's possible you are confusing Servotronic with Active Steering. Servotronic does exactly what you are mentioning: tightens the steering at higher speed (more effort is required when moving the steering) and gradually loosens it at lower speeds (less effort required).

Active Steering, a part from doing what Servotronic does, also changes the ratio of the steering, meaning the following: at lower speed, per every input on the steering wheel, the front wheels "turn" more than they would do at higher speeds, and vice-versa. I had this on a Q5 3.0 Tdi and it was by far one of the greatest features, it really made the car feel very nimble and agile at lower speeds that the conventional steering with standard Servotronic.

Please keep in mind that Servotronic was not part of standard equipment on the E70 X5 (at least in most markets), while it is standard on the new F15.

I hope this helps.

Take care,
Alessandro
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 05:58 PM   #8
chrisny
Brigadier General
chrisny's Avatar
United_States
547
Rep
3,307
Posts

Drives: 2020 X5 40i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: NY

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patarix
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisny View Post
Active steering doesn't make it more agile, the active damping (adaptive drive) does. Active steering tightens up the steering feel (amount of effort required) when cornering and loosens for low speed driving (parking lots etc).
Hello Chrisny,

It's possible you are confusing Servotronic with Active Steering. Servotronic does exactly what you are mentioning: tightens the steering at higher speed (more effort is required when moving the steering) and gradually loosens it at lower speeds (less effort required).

Active Steering, a part from doing what Servotronic does, also changes the ratio of the steering, meaning the following: at lower speed, per every input on the steering wheel, the front wheels "turn" more than they would do at higher speeds, and vice-versa. I had this on a Q5 3.0 Tdi and it was by far one of the greatest features, it really made the car feel very nimble and agile at lower speeds that the conventional steering with standard Servotronic.

Please keep in mind that Servotronic was not part of standard equipment on the E70 X5 (at least in most markets), while it is standard on the new F15.

I hope this helps.

Take care,
Alessandro
was simply pointing out that active steering and active damping are completely different and NOT redundant, as the OP thought they were.
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 07:02 PM   #9
jman26
Private
United_States
29
Rep
70
Posts

Drives: 2014 X5 msport active steer
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: United States

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2015 F15  [0.00]
Drove the "19 at my dealer today before finalizing the order. There was no real difference in ride feel so i stuck w the xline. After reading some posts i tested the ceramic knobs and decided to add them as well. Really an asthetic thing only, however it does feel nice in the hand and is smoother to toggle through the menus. Also if you use the shifter in sport mode a lot it really is worth it. I always drive w my hand on the shifter out of habit so i added it. Thanks all for the input.
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 08:41 PM   #10
MysticBlue
Lieutenant Colonel
369
Rep
1,887
Posts

Drives: '20 M5C, '09 M3 DCT Coupe
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Eastern Oregon... They call 'em rigs here

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patarix View Post
Hello Chrisny,

It's possible you are confusing Servotronic with Active Steering. Servotronic does exactly what you are mentioning: tightens the steering at higher speed (more effort is required when moving the steering) and gradually loosens it at lower speeds (less effort required).

Active Steering, a part from doing what Servotronic does, also changes the ratio of the steering, meaning the following: at lower speed, per every input on the steering wheel, the front wheels "turn" more than they would do at higher speeds, and vice-versa. I had this on a Q5 3.0 Tdi and it was by far one of the greatest features, it really made the car feel very nimble and agile at lower speeds that the conventional steering with standard Servotronic.

Please keep in mind that Servotronic was not part of standard equipment on the E70 X5 (at least in most markets), while it is standard on the new F15.

I hope this helps.

Take care,
Alessandro
You are correct. Anytime I've driven Active Steering I disliked it. I don't mind effort changing under appropriate circumstances, but ratio changes drove me nuts. When you drive a vehicle enough, the ratio becomes an extension of your hand-eye-steering coordination. Driving out on the highway and on the streets it has a normal ratio that your brain learns and it becomes like muscle memory, automatic without thinking about it, then I pull into a parking lot and that same amount of steering wheel movement is suddenly turning my tires way more than I expected. It's disconcerting and unnecessary. Servotronic just changes the amount of effort it takes to turn the wheel, (power steering boost). I got no problem with that, but I don't think it's necessary.
__________________
M5C 20% tint, Xpel full front, partial sides and rear. Spacers, 15mm front, 12mm rear. Turner Motorsport Oil Cooler Guard.
M3: Active Autowerke filter, Dinan underdrive pulley, Dinan full exhaust and software, 3.45 Differential, Springs, Brakes, Dinan/HRE wheels, 275/30-19 w/10mm spacer, 295/30-19 w/3mm spacer, painted front reflectors, 30% tint, Escort 8500i & Lidar Jammer, LUX H8 V5 halos, Euro rear foglights, 3M ClearBra.

Last edited by MysticBlue; 08-19-2013 at 07:44 PM..
Appreciate 0
      08-14-2013, 09:23 PM   #11
jman26
Private
United_States
29
Rep
70
Posts

Drives: 2014 X5 msport active steer
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: United States

iTrader: (0)

Garage List
2015 F15  [0.00]
Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticBlue View Post
You are correct. Anytime I've driven Active Steering I disliked it. I don't mind effort changing under appropriate circumstances, but ratio changes drove me nuts. When you drive a vehicle enough, the ratio becomes an extension of your hand-eye-steering coordination. Driving out on the highway and on the streets it has a normal ratio that your brain learns and it becomes like muscle memory, automatic without thinking about it, then I pull into a parking lot and that same amount of steering wheel movement is suddenly tuning my tires way more than I expected. It's disconcerting and unnecessary. Servotronic just changes the amount of effort it takes to turn the wheel, (power steering boost). I got no problem with that, but I don't think it's necessary.
Thank you for all the clarification on this. I was not aware that Servtronic wasnt on the '13 x5 model. That changes things. I simply felt the current model was a bit cumbersome to navigate in parking lots. I am now wondering if the active steering is neccesary as servtronic should fix some of this and the car is also 200lbs lighter. Im sure one would get used to active driving and like it after time, i am now just not sure it is a must have for $1500.

None of us can know for sure without driving it but it seems my issue should be resolved w atandard equipmemt on the f15.

Thank you mysticblue
Appreciate 0
      08-19-2013, 10:22 AM   #12
newbimmerx5
Second Lieutenant
67
Rep
259
Posts

Drives: BMW X5
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: United States

iTrader: (0)

The active steering may be worth for $1500 on E70.
However, BMW changed the steering to electric and would definitely benefit on F15. I would definitely add Active Steering on F15 had they not changed it. Particularly, it will benefit my wife immensely during parking.
I don't think it's worth on F15 anymore.

Thanks for your update on 19". It helps me to make informed decision on xLine.
Appreciate 0
      08-19-2013, 10:52 AM   #13
760Lifan
Major
760Lifan's Avatar
451
Rep
1,115
Posts

Drives: 2022 4xe Summit R & Trailhawk
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Land O Lakes, FL

iTrader: (0)

Just FYI if a member is interested in Active Steering:

If you order Active Steering, you can't get 5DP Parking Assistant and even worse, from 12/2013 on, ordering Active Steering makes it impossible to get 5AT ACC Stop & Go due to the introduction of 5AR Traffic Jam Assistant (which is automatically added from then on if you order 5AT).

Although 5AT is compatible with Active Steering, 5AR isn't. So if you are really interested in Active Steering and Active Cruise Control, you would have to place your order prior to 12/2013 or you will be forced to decide between the two.
Appreciate 0
      03-01-2014, 05:35 PM   #14
JDR32
New Member
0
Rep
8
Posts

Drives: 2014 x35i
Join Date: Feb 2014
Location: MonCo, NJ

iTrader: (0)

The thing about the 20"s is that the rears have 315 tires. I've never had tires that wide, and I think the biggest difference I feel is better stability at higher speed. If that makes sense. The ride is still good and not as harsh as I thought it might be. I was bummed about the summer tires, but I figure I would get a different rim anyways with better tires for the winter. The potholes are insane this winter around NJ, even with the rim insurance I would feel bad damaging one.

Has anyone read about the carbon fiber rim BMW made? don't seem right.
Appreciate 0
      03-01-2014, 06:04 PM   #15
gorun
Lieutenant
gorun's Avatar
45
Rep
528
Posts

Drives: W166 ML63 PP
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Where the roads are crap...

iTrader: (0)

There is a noticeable drop in ride quality when going from 19s to 20s. There is a difference in performance as the 20s are much heavier and also wider (more rolling resistance and more noise). But they look much better and give better cornering. It is a trade off you have to make up your own mind about.
Appreciate 0
      03-01-2014, 06:14 PM   #16
golovan
Second Lieutenant
United_States
28
Rep
203
Posts

Drives: 2015 X5 35D
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Houston

iTrader: (0)

Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisny View Post
the active damping (adaptive drive)
Is active damping the same what adaptive drive is? I thought they are a bit different things. Do you have any information about it?
Appreciate 0
      03-01-2014, 08:01 PM   #17
bradbragg
Private
United_States
19
Rep
81
Posts

Drives: 2014 X5 sDrive 35i
Join Date: Nov 2013
Location: Florida

iTrader: (0)

Question Worried now

Ok, you guys are staring to freak me out a little bit about 19 vs 20 inch wheels. I have on order an X5 with 451 20" wheels. I was debating about those and the xline's 449 wheels but decided on the 451s because I liked the way they looked better.

Is there really that big of a difference in ride quality? I would prefer more of a comfort type ride but didn't think the difference would be that noticeable. I would particularly appreciate any current 451 owners feedback on this.

Thanks!
Appreciate 0
      03-01-2014, 09:07 PM   #18
Artdnj
Captain
Artdnj's Avatar
United_States
394
Rep
706
Posts

Drives: 2023 X3 X30i
Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Garden State

iTrader: (0)

Any idea of 19" rims for the winter set up? Are most going with BMW or aftermarket winter rim and tire set up? Suggestions appreciated...
Appreciate 0
      03-02-2014, 12:27 PM   #19
chrisny
Brigadier General
chrisny's Avatar
United_States
547
Rep
3,307
Posts

Drives: 2020 X5 40i
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: NY

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by golovan
Quote:
Originally Posted by chrisny View Post
the active damping (adaptive drive)
Is active damping the same what adaptive drive is? I thought they are a bit different things. Do you have any information about it?
I believe what used to be called "adaptive drive" in the sport package on the original E70 is now the adaptive m suspension, both use active damping. Not sure what else might be involved or what differences are as it's evolved, but my understanding is the active damping is the main component (maybe only, not sure).
Appreciate 0
      03-02-2014, 12:56 PM   #20
archivedaccount
Guest
0
Rep
n/a
Posts

Drives:


I could be wrong, but adaptive m susp on the f15 is dynamic dampers + rear air susp. Dynamic dampers is the same as vdc on other models.

The e70 (and other models) adaptive drive is vdc + dynamic anti roll, so would be the same as the f15 dynamic handling package.

Like I say I could be wrong on this so hopefully someone can chime in definitively
Appreciate 0
      03-03-2014, 09:36 AM   #21
atomic80
Lieutenant
404
Rep
561
Posts

Drives: 997TT
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Bellevue, WA

iTrader: (0)

Quote:
Originally Posted by MysticBlue View Post
Shouldn't be any difference in snow traction between 18" and 19" all weather tires... they both suck. I know this wasn't specifically what you asked, so feel free to ignore my rant, I just bring it up for anyone who is concerned about winter traction. Last year I went from all weathers to snow and ice rated on my Dakota. Huge difference in the snow and ice. I could put it in 2wd in situations where I used to put it in 4wd and could hardly tell I wasn't in 4wd. When I get the X5, I plan on getting 20" with performance tires, and a separate set of 19" with snow and ice tires. I know not everyone wants to spend the extra money on wheels, but it makes it quick and easy to change over for winter driving, and I don't plan on ever driving on all weather tires again. A tire that tries to do everything doesn't do anything well.
But to answer your question, I don't think there will be much difference between 18 and 19 inchers. Get what you want.
I absolutely agree with you! I was blown away myself too how much better a dedicated set of winter tires are than all season tires. I have a set of Nokian studded/winter tires on my Range Rover and they were unmatched on ice/snow roads. I wanted to get the same setup for my incoming X5 but these models were unfortunately discontinued. I picked up the next best thing with a set of 19" wheels:
Appreciate 0
      03-03-2014, 07:01 PM   #22
barcelona
Major
barcelona's Avatar
Canada
269
Rep
1,417
Posts

Drives: X
Join Date: Jul 2013
Location: Toronto

iTrader: (0)

Many know that there is a difference between an "all season" and an " all weather".
However some may not, hence I believe the latter would have a snowflake within the Mountain on the sidewall to denote that the tire has met the performance in snow testing. Thus IMO if one encounters very cold with much snow then dedicated winters would be a great choice. Otherwise with less cold & snow "all weathers" may suffice as I deem adequate in my specific driving location.
Appreciate 0
Post Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:01 AM.




xbimmers
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.11
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions Inc.
1Addicts.com, BIMMERPOST.com, E90Post.com, F30Post.com, M3Post.com, ZPost.com, 5Post.com, 6Post.com, 7Post.com, XBimmers.com logo and trademark are properties of BIMMERPOST