Datalogs showing insane temps

BerkTechnology · 07-08-2010, 11:04 PM

This datalog was taken this past weekend at the Redline Time Attack at Willow Springs Raceway, the big track. Ambient temps were around 95F, track surface temps were hovering in the 120-130F range. A couple of things we can infer here.

-The car is a hair away from going into limp mode due to the coolant temps.
-I need to be using a large meth nozzle or better intercooler, or both.
-Oil temps are not showing up in the datalog but we can make a pretty safe assumption that there were close to coolant temps of 240 deg which is acceptable for this car. Our AR Design oil cooler is doing it's job, the OEM radiator is not.

We need to replace our radiator as it developed a leak in the plastic end tank or we have a leak coming from somewhere else. We've been running the car with just the OEM coolant mix this whole time but now it's time for us to either convert the car over to waterless NPG or 80/20 water/coolant mix. A full battery of temp gauges are also going in the car so we can better monitor the temps when we are out there on the track surface.

And a few pics over the weekend:

onesuperboi · 07-08-2010, 11:13 PM

What are your mods and tune?

I think you may consider the AR radiator to upgrade from the stock one. You could also provide some results for us.

http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...light=radiator

Overboost · 07-08-2010, 11:17 PM

Damn 183F IATs!!!

R1000K3 · 07-09-2010, 12:19 AM

117 C coolant temp

Ilma · 07-09-2010, 12:24 AM

You should be seeing a yellow warning indicator on the dash when coolant temps hit 248F and the engine shuts itself down at 264F.

You are running really close to that threshold but it's intereting that you only peaked at 242F only that one time......even though you hit the same road speed later on

In daily street driving I see my coolant temps fluctuate around 210-215F.

I think a lot of people who run meth may see lower intake temps, but I often wonder about their oil and coolant temps - looks like you may have answered that question.

Lower intake temps due to meth may be giving a false sense of security that the entire engine is running cooler when it is not.

benton0311 · 07-09-2010, 12:43 AM

Needs a bigger radiator! Better ventilation for increased airflow through it too.

There was a track test/comparison a few years ago I saw on youtube. I think it was edmunds, not sure. It was a 335i vs a G37 on the track in the summer. Everything was going great for the 335i and it was effortlessly outclassing the G37 in every category. Looked like it was gonna be an easy win and then all of the sudden the 335i overheated and went into limp mode. The nod went by default to the G37 because it didn't break down on the track.

The stock radiator is definitely too small for hard use. I there's also inadequate airflow through the radiator as well as there's really no where for the air to go when it flows through it. Really needs some type of side vent.

So many folks want to upgrade the oil cooler but that's only a bandaid. The real issue is inadequate water cooling.

lpphreakx06 · 07-09-2010, 01:09 AM

wow, reall nice 1er

BerkTechnology · 07-09-2010, 02:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilma

You should be seeing a yellow warning indicator on the dash when coolant temps hit 248F and the engine shuts itself down at 264F.

You are running really close to that threshold but it's intereting that you only peaked at 242F only that one time......even though you hit the same road speed later on

In daily street driving I see my coolant temps fluctuate around 210-215F.

I think a lot of people who run meth may see lower intake temps, but I often wonder about their oil and coolant temps - looks like you may have answered that question.

Lower intake temps due to meth may be giving a false sense of security that the entire engine is running cooler when it is not.

Even though the road speed is the same they are on two different parts of the track. It is the long straight that is brutal on the ECT & IAT temps. The same exact thing happens on the same part of the track at the 9min mark on the datalog.

In the other areas of the track map the temps are still very hot, but are not as bad as the 240 deg on that long front straight.

jblackwell · 07-09-2010, 10:14 AM

IAT at 183 just plain sucks.

Ilma · 07-09-2010, 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jblackwell

IAT at 183 just plain sucks.

Lol.....stock cars with the stock intercooler can see close to 150F on sustained runs.

ar design · 07-09-2010, 10:26 AM

An all-aluminum radiator is a must have if you drive your car hard!

5soko · 07-09-2010, 10:31 AM

Nice update and thanks for sharing!

SO a updated radiator and mix is going in to try to help this problem? What company radiator?

dzenno · 07-09-2010, 10:52 AM

ar design, do you have graphs like the one above comparing your radiator with stock?

Alpina_B3_Lux · 07-09-2010, 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dzenno

ar design, do you have graphs like the one above comparing your radiator with stock?

I hope to be able to provide some within short.

I'm currently running the stock radiator and intend to do some laps on the famous Nürburgring on Sunday. Good conditions for testing as it's quite hot right now (more than 30 degrees Celsius). I'll try to log the water temps (as well as IATs and oil temps) for some laps. Next week I'll then have my AR Design aluminium radiator installed and will try to repeat the same testing on the 26th of July at the same location. I'm running meth and have the AR Design additional oil cooler.

Just FYI, E92Fan also had water temps problems on our last Nürburgring trip, but only after (I think) at least 5 consecutive laps when the car went into limp mode. I therefore also think that it's a good idea to upgrade your stock radiator (in particular when tracking the car), also because the stock plastic unit seems prone to leaks (it's not the first time I heard that).

Alpina_B3_Lux

dzenno · 07-09-2010, 11:06 AM

do you have this ar oil cooler in addition to your stock or did you replace your stock?

rismo · 07-09-2010, 11:08 AM

To chime in, Im currently dealing with a water pump related issue, (See my thread on the forum) and i'm just back from my dealer.
I asked them about the proper water temp on the system, to their opinion it should be around 114c. Maybe this helps. Bentley states the same as far as I remember.

BerkTechnology · 07-09-2010, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dzenno

do you have this ar oil cooler in addition to your stock or did you replace your stock?

We're running a "special" AR Design oil cooler.

dzenno · 07-09-2010, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BerkTechnology

We're running a "special" AR Design oil cooler.

so stock is out?

what about you Alpina? Are you running it dual setup or just the ar oil cooler?

Jeff@TopGearSolutions · 07-09-2010, 11:30 AM

Whats interesting and not noted is that those temps are with a hood with all those vents imagine a stock hood.... OOOF

Clap135 · 07-09-2010, 11:33 AM

You sure the Meth is working? What nozzle?

Alpina_B3_Lux · 07-09-2010, 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dzenno

so stock is out?

what about you Alpina? Are you running it dual setup or just the ar oil cooler?

I have the stock oil cooler plus the ar design one that is mounted behind the grille.

Alpina_B3_Lux

Jeff@TopGearSolutions · 07-09-2010, 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Clap135

You sure the Meth is working? What nozzle?

I didnt even realize he said hes running meth, now im more confused...

How much boost is he running as well. Eitherway on a road course you are going to need a large tank of meth, I would say atleast 2.5 Gallon and even then im not sure if its going to be enough if you start using larger nozzles.

There is either a flaw in the tank design, air in the line, clog in the line, or an extremely small nozzle being used.

I'm curious about the meth setup as well.

07-08-2010, 11:04 PM	#1
BerkTechnology Lieutenant Colonel 223 Rep 1,565 Posts Drives: Fast Join Date: May 2008 Location: Irvine, CA iTrader: (1)	Datalogs showing insane temps - HOT HOT HOT!! This datalog was taken this past weekend at the Redline Time Attack at Willow Springs Raceway, the big track. Ambient temps were around 95F, track surface temps were hovering in the 120-130F range. A couple of things we can infer here. -The car is a hair away from going into limp mode due to the coolant temps. -I need to be using a large meth nozzle or better intercooler, or both. -Oil temps are not showing up in the datalog but we can make a pretty safe assumption that there were close to coolant temps of 240 deg which is acceptable for this car. Our AR Design oil cooler is doing it's job, the OEM radiator is not. We need to replace our radiator as it developed a leak in the plastic end tank or we have a leak coming from somewhere else. We've been running the car with just the OEM coolant mix this whole time but now it's time for us to either convert the car over to waterless NPG or 80/20 water/coolant mix. A full battery of temp gauges are also going in the car so we can better monitor the temps when we are out there on the track surface. And a few pics over the weekend:
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07-08-2010, 11:13 PM	#2
onesuperboi Major 52 Rep 1,357 Posts Drives: '08 e92 335i COBB 4.01 Stage 1 Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Bay Area, CA (Alameda) iTrader: (6)	What are your mods and tune? I think you may consider the AR radiator to upgrade from the stock one. You could also provide some results for us. http://www.e90post.com/forums/showth...light=radiator
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07-08-2010, 11:17 PM	#3
Overboost Second Lieutenant 14 Rep 284 Posts Drives: Monaco Blue 335i Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: Kentucky iTrader: (0)	Damn 183F IATs!!!
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07-09-2010, 12:19 AM	#4
R1000K3 Major 56 Rep 1,311 Posts Drives: 335i MT Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: USA iTrader: (0)	117 C coolant temp
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07-09-2010, 12:24 AM	#5
Ilma Colonel 184 Rep 2,841 Posts Drives: 2008 135i Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Mississauga iTrader: (0)	You should be seeing a yellow warning indicator on the dash when coolant temps hit 248F and the engine shuts itself down at 264F. You are running really close to that threshold but it's intereting that you only peaked at 242F only that one time......even though you hit the same road speed later on In daily street driving I see my coolant temps fluctuate around 210-215F. I think a lot of people who run meth may see lower intake temps, but I often wonder about their oil and coolant temps - looks like you may have answered that question. Lower intake temps due to meth may be giving a false sense of security that the entire engine is running cooler when it is not.
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07-09-2010, 12:43 AM	#6
benton0311 Lance Corporal 19 Rep 128 Posts Drives: 08 335i, Graphite Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Maryland iTrader: (1)	Needs a bigger radiator! Better ventilation for increased airflow through it too. There was a track test/comparison a few years ago I saw on youtube. I think it was edmunds, not sure. It was a 335i vs a G37 on the track in the summer. Everything was going great for the 335i and it was effortlessly outclassing the G37 in every category. Looked like it was gonna be an easy win and then all of the sudden the 335i overheated and went into limp mode. The nod went by default to the G37 because it didn't break down on the track. The stock radiator is definitely too small for hard use. I there's also inadequate airflow through the radiator as well as there's really no where for the air to go when it flows through it. Really needs some type of side vent. So many folks want to upgrade the oil cooler but that's only a bandaid. The real issue is inadequate water cooling.
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07-09-2010, 01:09 AM	#7
lpphreakx06 Professional Moose Racer 316 Rep 7,509 Posts Drives: SG 335i E92 RIP + 2015 SS M3 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Bellevue, Wa iTrader: (25)	wow, reall nice 1er __________________ Visit my blog anytime: http://www.sfpayments.com BMW Dream Team PNW Chapter, member #1 \|HP Autowerks \| AR DESIGN \| BMW PERFORMANCE \| STOP TECH \| Volk Racing\| AMS \| ARKYM
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07-09-2010, 10:14 AM	#9
jblackwell Captain 52 Rep 811 Posts Drives: 335 Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Cave Creek, AZ iTrader: (13)	IAT at 183 just plain sucks. __________________ '08 TiAg E90 335 M-Aero kit. - SOLD
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07-09-2010, 10:26 AM	#11
ar design 297 Rep 4,408 Posts Drives: 04 M3 Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Denver, CO iTrader: (9)	An all-aluminum radiator is a must have if you drive your car hard!
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07-09-2010, 10:31 AM	#12
5soko Brigadier General 333 Rep 4,632 Posts Drives: M5 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Brooklyn, NY iTrader: (4)	Nice update and thanks for sharing! SO a updated radiator and mix is going in to try to help this problem? What company radiator?
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07-09-2010, 10:52 AM	#13
dzenno Banned 273 Rep 5,876 Posts Drives: Join Date: Feb 2006 iTrader: (1)	ar design, do you have graphs like the one above comparing your radiator with stock?
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07-09-2010, 11:06 AM	#15
dzenno Banned 273 Rep 5,876 Posts Drives: Join Date: Feb 2006 iTrader: (1)	do you have this ar oil cooler in addition to your stock or did you replace your stock?
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07-09-2010, 11:08 AM	#16
rismo Captain 76 Rep 911 Posts Drives: BMW E92 335 Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Europe iTrader: (0)	To chime in, Im currently dealing with a water pump related issue, (See my thread on the forum) and i'm just back from my dealer. I asked them about the proper water temp on the system, to their opinion it should be around 114c. Maybe this helps. Bentley states the same as far as I remember. __________________ BMW 335 E92 09 - Full options - DKG - MHD by Buraq - RB Next Gen - RB Inlets/Outlet - Forge Diverter Valves - AR Catless DP - Afe Intake - Helix IC - FuelIT Stage 2 LPFP - Ar Oil Cooler - PPK Water Cooler - M3 Suspension - JRZ RS1 Shocks - Eibach Pro Springs - Drexler LSD - BMW IS Exhaust - Carbon Endurance Brake Pads - Stainless Steel Brake Lines - M101 Wheels - Michelin PS2 - M-Tech Body - M-Strutbar BMW M550i G30 2019 - BM3
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07-09-2010, 11:30 AM	#19
Jeff@TopGearSolutions 3441 Rep 79,211 Posts Drives: C6 Z06, 09 335i, 10 335xi Join Date: Dec 2008 Location: www.TopGearSolutions.com iTrader: (37)	Whats interesting and not noted is that those temps are with a hood with all those vents imagine a stock hood.... OOOF
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07-09-2010, 11:33 AM	#20
Clap135 Brigadier General 102 Rep 3,460 Posts Drives: 2009 N54 Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Sticky's Mom House iTrader: (1)	You sure the Meth is working? What nozzle?
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