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      01-19-2008, 05:29 AM   #1
rdkind62
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Long term maint. of the twin turbo

I have never owned a vehicle with turbo before and I have read in here a few times that people think the long time use of the turbo engine is going to be significantly more expensive to maintain than the non-turbo engine.

My question is how may miles of normal use (not tracking the vehicle) should I expect out of the N54 before it will need a significant engine service? I know it is covered up to 4 years or 50K. I am talking beyond those points.:iono:
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      01-19-2008, 11:42 AM   #2
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Frequent oil changes, IMO, are a big thing. Gotta have clean oil flowing through those turbos.

Also, give them a little time to cool down after you've been whooping on them. I usually go for a two minute gentle drive around town without getting into boost to let the turbos (and especially those bearings) cool down.

Idling the engine for 30 seconds or so before you kill the car after one of these drives isn't a bad idea either.

If I'm not mistaken, our turbos are primarily oil cooled, which makes all of this doubly important, and would make a bigger oil cooler a significant upgrade for reliability!
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      01-19-2008, 12:56 PM   #3
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I thought they were water cooled? Either way, letting them cool is the best method. But frequent oil changes will get expensive as BMW will only do the 15,000 thing. (?)
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      01-19-2008, 03:37 PM   #4
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Unless they changed this, Mitsubishi turbochargers are usually water and oil cooled in my experience with them (a separate fluid line for each going into the turbo center section.)

Using real synthetic oil after the engine's break-in period will go a long way in keeping a turbocharged engine just as reliable as any engine. You could easily run 200k miles or more before any serious overhaul was required. For many people that would be literally decades of service.
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      01-19-2008, 07:29 PM   #5
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I predict that the majority of the n54 engines will live a long life and go to the junk yard without ever having the engine cracked open, or the turbos touched.

Just one man's opinion. Nothing factual to back it up with, other than running chipped for 70K+ of the last 100K+ miles on my turbo engine. I expect a BMW to do at least as well.


EDIT: Oh yea, I forgot to talk about the tiny size and light weight of the n54 turbos making them less likely to frag themselves into little pieces than big turbos. I'd throw around some spiffy engineering terms like "Moment of Inertia" or "Axial Acceleration" or something like that -- if I knew what all that stuff means.
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      01-19-2008, 11:14 PM   #6
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Yes, both oil and water cooled turbos. Plus the water pump will continue to run after engine shutdown to further cool the turbos if necessary.
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      01-19-2008, 11:33 PM   #7
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My mistake. I thought I heard they were just oil cooled.
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      01-20-2008, 12:13 AM   #8
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2008 135i  [6.80]
turbo timer time?
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      01-20-2008, 05:49 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by izzodesh View Post
turbo timer time?

No, a Turbo timer is a waste. My last 2 cars were turbo cars and I did install a turbo timer. If your driving the car normal, a normal shutdown is fine. If you just raced the car and pulled into a parking lot, just let it idle a short time, and you should be fine. You just don't want to run the car hard(high boost situation) and immediatly shut the car down.
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      01-21-2008, 06:48 AM   #10
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The water pump running after the car cuts off pretty much does the exact same thing as the turbo timer does, except the turbos are not moving at all so they create no additional heat so it is even betterr IMO.
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      01-21-2008, 11:33 AM   #11
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Actaully, you need to let the oil cool down also. So, as stated above, if you have just driven the car hard, just let it idle for a bit to get the temps down. Most of the time you are driving the car, you are not racing into a parking spot and immediately shutting it down. If you are racing at the track, lift your hood and let it idle for a bit so that the oil temp comes down also.
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      01-21-2008, 12:03 PM   #12
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I'm curious if a larger oil pan would help cool the oil as well. And if so, to what degree.
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      01-23-2008, 11:11 AM   #13
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I was talking candidly with my guy from BMW the other day and asked if there was any concern about the turbo longevity of the N54 engine, especially in the hands of (presumably younger, tuning oriented) 135i owners. He said so far the warranty claim rate for 335s has been normal and he's not aware of any inherent weaknesses in the engine. He did admit that the 135i will likely bring any shortcomings to the surface quicker if it becomes the tuners' choice.

FWIW, I used to run a tuning shop that did a lot of VW/Audi 1.8T and 2.7T tuning, and we never sold or installed turbo timers. Drive like a rational human being for a minute or so before shutting the car down and you'll do just fine. Not only do I find them to be useless gimmicks, I also haven't found a single one that doesn't look like an utter afterthought once it's installed. Be sensible with your warmup and shutdown, and maintain the oil and you'll be fine. My $.02.
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      01-23-2008, 11:19 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madjack View Post
Actaully, you need to let the oil cool down also. So, as stated above, if you have just driven the car hard, just let it idle for a bit to get the temps down. Most of the time you are driving the car, you are not racing into a parking spot and immediately shutting it down. If you are racing at the track, lift your hood and let it idle for a bit so that the oil temp comes down also.
Well said. If you are parking after some hard acceleration just park and tie your shoes or finish the song on the radio.
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      01-23-2008, 05:49 PM   #15
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More moving parts, more potential for problems...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sherifftruman View Post
The water pump running after the car cuts off pretty much does the exact same thing as the turbo timer does, except the turbos are not moving at all so they create no additional heat so it is even betterr IMO.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whereitsat
I'm curious if a larger oil pan would help cool the oil as well. And if so, to what degree.
The only thing a larger oil pan does is increase the oil supply(hopefully)...
Takes the engine longer to heat the oil and longer to cool it...
This is mainly a drag racing solution to overheating as it takes longer to get the oil to overheating temps.
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      01-24-2008, 09:33 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madjack View Post
Actaully, you need to let the oil cool down also. So, as stated above, if you have just driven the car hard, just let it idle for a bit to get the temps down. Most of the time you are driving the car, you are not racing into a parking spot and immediately shutting it down. If you are racing at the track, lift your hood and let it idle for a bit so that the oil temp comes down also.
Wouldn't the cool down lap more effectively cool the oil provide the most cooling?
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      02-22-2008, 10:14 PM   #17
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I am also a new soon to be turbo owner so knowing this information is vital to helping me keeping my brand new BMW in its prime.
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      02-22-2008, 10:36 PM   #18
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the less boost you use the better off the engine will be, these turbo motors run mild compression which offsets the compression increase when you're on the boost. in theory if you aren't always flogging the motor, you should get many, many miles do to the less stress when off boost. the higher the boost (psi) the higher the compression, which leads to detonation.
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      02-22-2008, 11:03 PM   #19
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Actually, the compression ratio of the N54 is 10.2:1 which is very high for a forced induction engine. Made possible by the superior fuel spray pattern of the new HPI piezo direct injection with outward opening injectors.
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      02-23-2008, 12:36 AM   #20
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mild compression compared to n/a motors. sorry i didn't make that clear
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      02-23-2008, 05:55 PM   #21
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A larger oil pan holds more oil and if designed correctly will help in the cooling. If you have more oil it will take longer to heat up which means at any particular time, it will be cooler than a stock oil pan. But, the cost may be prohibitive.

Quote:
Originally Posted by bryan@mwerks View Post
I was talking candidly with my guy from BMW the other day and asked if there was any concern about the turbo longevity of the N54 engine, especially in the hands of (presumably younger, tuning oriented) 135i owners. He said so far the warranty claim rate for 335s has been normal and he's not aware of any inherent weaknesses in the engine. He did admit that the 135i will likely bring any shortcomings to the surface quicker if it becomes the tuners' choice.

FWIW, I used to run a tuning shop that did a lot of VW/Audi 1.8T and 2.7T tuning, and we never sold or installed turbo timers. Drive like a rational human being for a minute or so before shutting the car down and you'll do just fine. Not only do I find them to be useless gimmicks, I also haven't found a single one that doesn't look like an utter afterthought once it's installed. Be sensible with your warmup and shutdown, and maintain the oil and you'll be fine. My $.02.

Agree! Use common sense. Give it a cool down. Check and change your oil often like between the recommended service intervals. It's not that expensive. The 135i comes from the factory with synthetic break-in oil. It's ok to change it at 5000 to 7500 miles but not before. When you do change it, use a good approved synthetic.
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      02-23-2008, 05:57 PM   #22
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Also remember. You don't get something for nothing.

The more you pump up the engine, the less life it's going to have. The more you abuse the engine, the less life it's going to have. But the way BMW builds engines, a little pumping up probably wont hurt.
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