BMW 1 Series Coupe Forum / 1 Series Convertible Forum (1M / tii / 135i / 128i / Coupe / Cabrio / Hatchback) (BMW E82 E88 128i 130i 135i)
 





 

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      10-07-2007, 01:18 PM   #1
Devon K
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Nasty experiences with the twin-turbo...

This from the Globe and Mail in Toronto:

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The 1-Series Cabriolets will take on the same engines as the coupes, so the 128i will get a 3.0-litre 230-horsepower inline-six, while the 135i Cab will get a twin-turbocharged version of that same engine, to the tune of 300 horsepower (that's what claimed, but it's likely more), and an equal figure for torque.

This engine has impressed all who've driven it, and garnered Ward's International Engine of the Year award for 2007, but various owner and media reports about engine overheating are somewhat troubling.

Numerous 335i owners have reported common overheating issues at high altitudes and at race-track days with this engine, a characteristic I experienced myself when an aggressive charge up a mountain road in a manual 535i led to a bank of warning lights and limp-home mode until we pulled off the road. Ten minutes of cooling off later, our 535i was fine, but even the technical gurus at BMW's Car Club of America website are saying that the 3.0-litre TT engine may not yet be up to hard-core racetrack duty.
Yikes - those buying the 135i sight unseen are really going to be rolling the dice! Here's hoping this overheating will be addressed with a few engine mods prior to release....
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      10-07-2007, 01:21 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devon K View Post
This from the Globe and Mail in Toronto:



Yikes - those buying the 135i sight unseen are really going to be rolling the dice! Here's hoping this overheating will be addressed with a few engine mods prior to release....
Dude, that must be an old article, the engine is oveheating because BMW failed to put Oil Cooler in some of their cars.
You can take it to the dealership and have one installed at no cost.

Old news! Problem solved
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      10-07-2007, 01:33 PM   #3
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Article is dated Oct 3, but it is possible the writer isn't up on the latest developments...
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      10-07-2007, 01:50 PM   #4
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Found this interesting comment by MIke Miller, BMW guru over at BMWCCA, suggesting the issue isn't fully resolved:
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The larger issue is, even with an oil cooler this engine runs inordinately high oil temperature. I don't think there is going to be a viable factory fix for this. I think any larger oil coolers we see in the future will be an aftermarket part, and the problem there is where to put it. Short of a NACA duct in the hood or some sort of Porsche-type design in the front wheel housings, I don't see where a larger oil cooler will fit.
Of course space will be an even bigger issue on the 1 series than the 335i he's talking about....
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      10-07-2007, 02:55 PM   #5
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I'm so excited that the 135i will be my first turbo car.
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      10-07-2007, 03:22 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Devon K View Post
Found this interesting comment by MIke Miller, BMW guru over at BMWCCA, suggesting the issue isn't fully resolved:


Of course space will be an even bigger issue on the 1 series than the 335i he's talking about....
That was something that I have been mentioning in other threads but some have ignored it. The oil cooler is only covering up the greater issue which is that this engine runs much hotter than it should.

And Garrett, the OP posted an article which mentioned the 2008 535i having the same problem. You like to think that this problem is gone, but it certainly isnt.
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      10-07-2007, 04:10 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPower View Post
And Garrett, the OP posted an article which mentioned the 2008 535i having the same problem. You like to think that this problem is gone, but it certainly isnt.
Took the words right out of my mouth!
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      10-07-2007, 05:06 PM   #8
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Another reason to get 128i!
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      10-07-2007, 09:24 PM   #9
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Yeah, you know what. The excessive heat of a turbo is just no good. Oh wait a minute, its got 2 turbos. Show me to the 128i.

However...the 128i does lack direct injection which is a concern. And I'm still concerned about long term galvanic corrosion issues in the 128i because of the unconventional aluminum/magnesuim engine block. anybody hear anything about that?
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      10-07-2007, 09:34 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WolfsburgerMitFries View Post
And I'm still concerned about long term galvanic corrosion issues in the 128i because of the unconventional aluminum/magnesuim engine block. anybody hear anything about that?
Hadn't thought of that. Might be an issue on a long enough time line. Hopefully, a very long time line.
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      10-08-2007, 04:04 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPower View Post
The oil cooler is only covering up the greater issue which is that this engine runs much hotter than it should.
Very true! Many people try to brush this off as a fix all end all. Or say that it is fine w/ synthetic. Some say its because of cylinders 2 and 6 (or whatever). Regardless of what it is, the fact of the matter is that they have had ample time to rectify the problem and they haven't yet. This is their first turbocharged motor in a long time... I figured it would take them a few tries to iron it out, but there are not that many issues that can cause a motor to overheat.

Now it seems to be more prevalent with auto cars and the oil cooler(normally std on turbo platforms and im suprized it didn't come w/ one to begin with) obviously lowers temps. But there are cars w/ the retrofit that still limp home.

There are ways of 'fixing' an overheating motor.

1. Lower the T-stat operating temp
2. Increase coolant flow/pressure
3. Use more water than coolant
4. Larger radiator
5. re-torque the heads
6. Increase airflow
7. Introduce a wetting agent to the coolant, ie: "water wetter" (Imo the greatest benefit of these products is that they raise the boiling temp of the water, reducing the possibility of hot spots)
8. etc.

However this should not be necessary for a properly designed motor. I think it is worth mentioning that not all n54's 'overheat'(to me this says 'quality control') and the ecu doesn't let it actually overheat.

.02
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      10-08-2007, 03:00 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by onehots2k View Post
I'm so excited that the 135i will be my first turbo car.
Was that a joke?
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      10-08-2007, 03:02 PM   #13
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I have a great solution for the overheating problem...

Just run your heater on high, ALL THE TIME... :biggrin:
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      10-08-2007, 04:17 PM   #14
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Guys,

The problem isn't the coolant temperature, it's the temperaure of the oil that's getting super heated by the turbos. Water wetter, adding a higher ratio of water, etc. isn't going to help the situation. This is why an OIL cooler is essential on any turbocharged engine, no matter how efficient it may seem.
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      10-08-2007, 05:15 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kurichan View Post
Just run your heater on high, ALL THE TIME...


I didn't want to list this one because it just felt too redneck.
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      10-08-2007, 06:57 PM   #16
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It's a good thing they will be including an oil cooler in the optional Sport Package for the 135.
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      10-08-2007, 07:14 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zba857 View Post


I didn't want to list this one because it just felt too redneck.
LOL. People do it at track events all the time, but only AFTER a run!
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      10-09-2007, 01:35 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kurichan View Post
I have a great solution for the overheating problem...

Just run your heater on high, ALL THE TIME... :biggrin:
Reminds me of my 69 Austin Healey. LOL
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      10-09-2007, 08:02 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MPower View Post
That was something that I have been mentioning in other threads but some have ignored it. The oil cooler is only covering up the greater issue which is that this engine runs much hotter than it should.

And Garrett, the OP posted an article which mentioned the 2008 535i having the same problem. You like to think that this problem is gone, but it certainly isnt.



Listen,

All turbocharged engines run hot without the use of an oil cooler. How many turbo charged engines don't have an oil cooler..?

Secondly, a lead engineer from BMW has said the N54 runs hotter than most engines, he stressed this was somehow related to BMWefficiencydynamics.

Thirdly, I have not heard of a 335i/535i WITH an oil cooler overheating. Have you..?


Suggesting that the oil cooler is covering up the fact that the engine runs hot, is like saying that a radiator hides the same fact. BMW is so confident in it's engine building they decided to sell certain biturbocharged cars without an Oil Cooler. Why..?

Nobody knows, but the simple fact of the matter is that there ARE 335i's with no oil cooler that don't overheat. To me, thats remarkable.

"The Problem" is that BMW is still selling cars without an oil cooler. The good news is that the car itself won't be harmed because it will protect itself and go into limp mode if it reaches 302 degree. In which you can then take it to the dealer and get your free oil cooler installed!

This seems to be a concern of many people and I don't blame them. But when reality sets in, many have watched their oil read 280 all day long but never hit 290. Alot higher than normal and what we are use to, but then again, this isn't a normal engine and 280 degrees is normal for this engine. It's just scary because we are use to low 200's.

Either way, even at it's severest level it is not our problem, but BMWs.






-Garrett
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      10-09-2007, 08:26 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
Suggesting that the oil cooler is covering up the fact that the engine runs hot, is like saying that a radiator hides the same fact.
heh. i was thinking the same thing.

i don't see anything fundamentally wrong with an engine running hotter than others as long as it was engineered to handle the higher operating point.
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      10-09-2007, 09:13 AM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
.....

Either way, even at it's severest level it is not our problem, but BMWs.


-Garrett
I agree with a lot of what you said....
further I think you'll eventually see more changes to this situation by BWM.
JMO but you'll see them put a performance, or efficient dynamics type of spin on what ever they do...
rather than fixing a "problem"

Regarding your quote above....
JMO but that's a way off base.
Shouldn't the person that owns the car out of warranty have a reasonable expectation for a good ownership experience?
If they don't... just watch what happens to future residuals.
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      10-09-2007, 03:01 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Garrett View Post
Thirdly, I have not heard of a 335i/535i WITH an oil cooler overheating. Have you..?
If you search you will find plenty...
Quote:
but the simple fact of the matter is that there ARE 335i's with no oil cooler that don't overheat. To me, thats remarkable.
That is no cause for confidence... That should tell you that it is a quality control issue. Some people get great cars and some don't. However these flukes are only manual cars. The steptronic cars are not nearly as track friendly(even some w/oil cooler). For clarity i will state that i am talking about tracked cars; i'm not talking about drivin Ms. Daisy here
Quote:
"The Problem" is that BMW is still selling cars without an oil cooler. The good news is that the car itself won't be harmed because it will protect itself and go into limp mode if it reaches 302 degree. In which you can then take it to the dealer and get your free oil cooler installed!
Once again if you search you will find that not everyone gets an oil cooler when they ask for it.
Quote:
Alot higher than normal and what we are use to, but then again, this isn't a normal engine and 280 degrees is normal for this engine.
Where did you get this information? IMO you are making too many assumptions about this issue. I suggest you read up on it.
Quote:
Either way, even at it's severest level it is not our problem, but BMWs.
Who said it was our problem? We are just having intelligent convo. :iono:
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