[Sennen]

I wondered how long it would take

Sunak is touting lifting CGT up to 40/45% in line with income tax and reducing the threshold to circa 4k.

I suspect pensions will be in the cross hairs pretty soon too.

You spend 35 years to try and build up a little nest egg to see you through retirement whilst paying a fortune in tax whilst taking sod all out but the wankers want even more.

I fear this will only be the start. Brace yourselves chaps tough times ahead

[KRS_SN]

Originally Posted by Sennen

I wondered how long it would take

Sunak is touting lifting CGT up to 40/45% in line with income tax and reducing the threshold to circa 4k.

I suspect pensions will be in the cross hairs pretty soon too.

You spend 35 years to try and build up a little nest egg to see you through retirement whilst paying a fortune in tax whilst taking sod all out but the wankers want even more.

I fear this will only be the start. Brace yourselves chaps tough times ahead

I don't own a second property but hate the fact that someone who has wisely invested and saved is an easy target to be robbed.

[gangzoom]

Originally Posted by Sennen

I fear this will only be the start. Brace yourselves chaps tough times ahead

You're almost certainly right, I can see marginal tax rates going up to 70% for anyone on 6 figures. The way I look it is am thankful to have a job.

[isleaiw1]

Tax is too complicated. I'd scrap CGT and just treat it as top slice of income in year sold, but I'd bring back indexation (its not a gain if its only kept pace with inflation ffs)

The trouble with tax hikes in those on higher incomes is that it encourages certain trades to not declare what they earn.... and of course if you are REALLY wealthy you will have advisors sorting out offshore trusts and what have you so it wont really affect you.

Income tax rates are all wrong. we talk about 20% basic rate, but if you only need to earn 50k to pay 40%, there are way too many people in middle management jobs paying the higher rate.

I'd start at 10% at £12k and go through to 50% at £200k, hitting 40% at about £75k and 45% at £125k I'd also drop the 60% rate between £100k and £125k (when you pay 40% tax and lose £1 of tax free pay for every £2 of every additional income). No idea what that would do to total tax take but it sounds fairer.

I'd have a third VAT rate for luxury goods too- proper discretionary spend items where its completely optional. Make that 40%.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by gangzoom

You're almost certainly right, I can see marginal tax rates going up to 70% for anyone on 6 figures. The way I look it is am thankful to have a job.

There is no way the Tories will do that - they would alienate most of their support overnight. Now Labour on the other hand.... However, Labour need middle England support to win and so they have to tread very carefully around those on maybe lower end of the 40% band....

[JustChris]

Some of the suggestions seem very harsh indeed. Pleased we have just last week off loaded property..and retirement is probably a few decades off.

It was always going to be paid for somehow, it won't be this serve and will come in many other forms.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by JustChris

Some of the suggestions seem very harsh indeed. Pleased we have just last week off loaded property..and retirement is probably a few decades off.

It was always going to be paid for somehow, it won't be this serve and will come in many other forms.

As I said to my son last night, you only pay CGT when you sell so looks like I am a landlord for life and kids can have the hassle!

I reckon with a bit of luck I can peak my earnings for next 2 to 3 years (well, except bonuses...) and then wind down when all the higher rates come in!

[aquazi]

You can gift an asset to avoid/ reduce your CGT.

I often gift some of my shares to my wife an then sell (or tell her to sell!!) to use up her allowance each year

Also as she is a 20% tax band i've transferred one of our second homes to her name so i can offload (will be 7 years next year - just hope the house prices remain boyant!)

I have no issue paying profit on an asset - and it makes sense for the govt to target the more wealthy than an indiscrimate tax like raising VAT - however all those corporations which pay little or no tax and raking in the cash - and they have no interest in closing that loop hole.

[JustChris]

Quick CGT property question, for a lower rate tax payer its 10% and something like a£12300 allowance first is that correct?

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by JustChris

Quick CGT property question, for a lower rate tax payer its 10% and something like a£12300 allowance first is that correct?

Allowance is correct. The rate depends if it is property or not as I think the rate is higher if the gain is on a property...

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by aquazi

You can gift an asset to avoid/ reduce your CGT.

I often gift some of my shares to my wife an then sell (or tell her to sell!!) to use up her allowance each year

Also as she is a 20% tax band i've transferred one of our second homes to her name so i can offload (will be 7 years next year - just hope the house prices remain boyant!)

I have no issue paying profit on an asset - and it makes sense for the govt to target the more wealthy than an indiscrimate tax like raising VAT - however all those corporations which pay little or no tax and raking in the cash - and they have no interest in closing that loop hole.

Only if you have someone to gift it too. Cant gift it to my son as he doesnt have a home and will want to use HtB next year - which means he has to be a first time buyer now (well next month). Cant gift to my daughter and not my son....

Its very hard to close that loophole. There are rules around transfer pricing to stop international movement of profit but they dont seem to be doing the job and these firms pay the big consultancies millions for tax advice - HMRC cant afford people who are as good!

[aquazi]

Originally Posted by JustChris

Quick CGT property question, for a lower rate tax payer its 10% and something like a£12300 allowance first is that correct?

For residential property its higher - something like 18% for lower rate and 28% higher rate.

But the allowance are correct for this tax year - but you can offset the costs/ improvements including legal fees.

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

Allowance is correct. The rate depends if it is property or not as I think the rate is higher if the gain is on a property...

For property the base rate is 18% and 28% for higher tax payers.

[aquazi]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

Only if you have someone to gift it too. Cant gift it to my son as he doesnt have a home and will want to use HtB next year - which means he has to be a first time buyer now (well next month). Cant gift to my daughter and not my son....

Setup a charity - set yourself up as the director; move the house in there.. then sell it... then drip feed yourself the proceeds as dividents.. and pay no CGT.

Before i get any backlash I want entirely serious!

But just gives you an idea of the sort of loop holes which do exist for this sort of thing.

Even the second home stamp duty surcharge i know people who have found ways around it.

[isleaiw1]

Originally Posted by aquazi

Setup a charity - set yourself up as the director; move the house in there.. then sell it... then drip feed yourself the proceeds as dividents.. and pay no CGT.

Before i get any backlash I want entirely serious!

But just gives you an idea of the sort of loop holes which do exist for this sort of thing.

Even the second home stamp duty surcharge i know people who have found ways around it.

I am a Chartered Accountant - wouldnt be worth the potential grief if I was found doing anything not entirely above board. I even refuse to pay cash to get a VAT reduction as clearly they then arent declaring it....!

I'll just keep it, and maybe move back in one day, who knows....

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

As I said to my son last night, you only pay CGT when you sell so looks like I am a landlord for life and kids can have the hassle!

I reckon with a bit of luck I can peak my earnings for next 2 to 3 years (well, except bonuses...) and then wind down when all the higher rates come in!

Yep it looks that way. I am just waiting now for Sunak to start messing about with IHT too.

I think it was Major or Thatcher that said wealth will 'cascade down through the generations'........................... i fear that will turn into a trickle.

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

Tax is too complicated. I'd scrap CGT and just treat it as top slice of income in year sold, but I'd bring back indexation (its not a gain if its only kept pace with inflation ffs)

The trouble with tax hikes in those on higher incomes is that it encourages certain trades to not declare what they earn.... and of course if you are REALLY wealthy you will have advisors sorting out offshore trusts and what have you so it wont really affect you.

Income tax rates are all wrong. we talk about 20% basic rate, but if you only need to earn 50k to pay 40%, there are way too many people in middle management jobs paying the higher rate.

I'd start at 10% at £12k and go through to 50% at £200k, hitting 40% at about £75k and 45% at £125k I'd also drop the 60% rate between £100k and £125k (when you pay 40% tax and lose £1 of tax free pay for every £2 of every additional income). No idea what that would do to total tax take but it sounds fairer.

I'd have a third VAT rate for luxury goods too- proper discretionary spend items where its completely optional. Make that 40%.

This is a very good point, there should at least be an allowance for inflation.

[Sennen]

Originally Posted by isleaiw1

I am a Chartered Accountant - wouldnt be worth the potential grief if I was found doing anything not entirely above board. I even refuse to pay cash to get a VAT reduction as clearly they then arent declaring it....!

I'll just keep it, and maybe move back in one day, who knows....

That is your only option i fear.

I want to offload my holiday home at some point in Cornwall, on the new rates I will be hit for £180k CGT, but do i really want to declare it my primary residence and live in cornwall for several years to avoid it.

I suspect they will manage to close that loop hole in any case

[Sennen]

Once my poor old Mum has departed this world I can see myself retiring abroad, been pondering the idea for a while now. At least then i wont have to give the shower of shit that runs this country any further tax on what I spend here.

[Tengocity]

Originally Posted by Sennen

That is your only option i fear.

I want to offload my holiday home at some point in Cornwall, on the new rates I will be hit for £180k CGT, but do i really want to declare it my primary residence and live in cornwall for several years to avoid it.

I suspect they will manage to close that loop hole in any case

Sorry, I'm not feeling a whole lot of sympathy for you here. You've got a lovely second home in a place where lots of ordinary locals haven't got a chance of getting on the property ladder. You've done well out of successive governments with a policy of juicing the property markets. Yes, you've made some smart investments, and sacrificed spending elsewhere to make the most of them. But plenty folk are working their knackers off and getting 40%+ taken off before they even get it.

Heaven forbid you'd have to actually live in Cornwall for a little while, I've no idea how you'd cope.

[Scoobyd]

Every year it's the same. Speculation of all these potential hikes and changes to the tax system, few to none of which actually come to pass. Not worth worrying about speculation until it becomes fact.

I've lost count of the amount of years I've been hearing higher rate tax relief on pensions is going to be scrapped in place of a flat rate for all. Still waiting...

[Watsey]

Let's stick with the property theme.

Let's say you bought a second home, purely as a private holiday home. What a luxury compared to the vast majority of people's financial means.

Or maybe you bought a property as a buy-to-let or AirBNB and use it as a source of income. A real luxury, beyond the means of many/most.

Perhaps you've been incredibly fortunate and have built a property portfolio and benefited massively by creating wealth via your own financial multiplier based on rental income from those unable to get onto the property ownership ladder and who find themselves trapped as 'tenants for life'. Simply unattainable for >99.xxx% of the population.

Liquidating investments generally triggers a tax bill. Pensions can't be 100% liquidated without a large tax bill, so why should property be any different ?

Few people with the means to create wealth are comfortable with tax, but would they rather not have the wealth in the first place ? I doubt it, and they always have the option to unchain themselves by giving it away.