[TXSTYLE]

Nice race.
That rear lip spoiler ruins the rear end of the otherwise gorgeous M5.
The Shelby is a Beast! Especially in the quarter. Looks and sounds sinister.

[David70]

Interesting race (at 5:40), 10 minute video to watch a 11 second race is a little much.

[quick]

Originally Posted by David70

Interesting race (at 5:40), 10 minute video to watch a 11 second

pass to see the BMW lose to a stang, no thanks

[AlexFL]

The difference is that GT500 and all other American high hp RWD cars only deliver on a perfectly prepped drag strip. M5 delivers everywhere.

[5.M0NSTER]

The GT500 is a beast, so no doubt it was going to win. I’m actually impressed how close behind the M5 is. That’s a good race for the bimmer.

[David70]

Originally Posted by AlexFL

The difference is that GT500 and all other American high hp RWD cars only deliver on a perfectly prepped drag strip. M5 delivers everywhere.

You think the results would be different on the street? Around a road course?Any proof?

Maybe we are back to the part where we talk about the great daily driver amenities or the soft/strokable dash?

[Alfisti]

I'll never understand the obsession you yanks have with drag racing times for street cars.

[5.M0NSTER]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

I'll never understand the obsession you yanks have with drag racing times for street cars.

That's because you don't realize how many thousands of straight road miles there are in 'Murica.

And that's actual fact. Take my home town for example. Detroit is a Grid. 36 miles, by 30 miles (roughly). But you get the idea. Light to light possibilities are all straight, and 36x30 possibilities. Not counting 1/2 mile lights. Plus look at I94, I80, I90, I75, I70 .... etc. Hundreds upon Thousands of straight miles. What do you do? You put the right foot down. If you get bored you go to the track. But on an average night? Eh?

[Alfisti]

Originally Posted by 5.M0NSTER

That's because you don't realize how many thousands of straight road miles there are in 'Murica.

And that's actual fact.

Oh I live in the absolute KING of straight roads, Toronto is the, hands down, dullest driving city anywhere in the world. I've seen more corners in Kansas (shit you not we had an office there).

I've always felt a rolling 40 to 120kmh would be more relevant for the road.

[AlexFL]

Originally Posted by David70

You think the results would be different on the street?

Yes, I think the results would have been different on the street with both cars launching from zero. GT500 would be struggling with grip at the launch. However, GT500 would likely win the rolling race.

[5.M0NSTER]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

Oh I live in the absolute KING of straight roads, Toronto is the, hands down, dullest driving city anywhere in the world. I've seen more corners in Kansas (shit you not we had an office there).

I've always felt a rolling 40 to 120kmh would be more relevant for the road.

Rolling 40 to XXX is also tons of fun. And favors the rear wheel drive only GT500 even more. Good Friday night fun! And Toronto has a bit of curves, I have family there!

[yousefnjr]

Originally Posted by AlexFL

The difference is that GT500 and all other American high hp RWD cars only deliver on a perfectly prepped drag strip. M5 delivers everywhere.

Here’s a public road for you...

I can guess what the next qualifiers will be

[SteveinArizona]

Originally Posted by AlexFL

The difference is that GT500 and all other American high hp RWD cars only deliver on a perfectly prepped drag strip. M5 delivers everywhere.

Exactly. I just watched an episode of Top Gear US and the episode was about american muscle cars (Camaro, Mustang and Challenger). All the contests were straight ahead.

Mustang GT500s and M5s play in different spaces. Each is very, very good at what it is good at. Buyers/lessee need to figure out what this is for them.

[David70]

Originally Posted by SteveinArizona

Exactly. I just watched an episode of Top Gear US and the episode was about american muscle cars (Camaro, Mustang and Challenger). All the contests were straight ahead.

Mustang GT500s and M5s play in different spaces. Each is very, very good at what it is good at. Buyers/lessee need to figure out what this is for them.

I would bet on the GT500 on a road course. There are a number of American cars that are pretty good on a road course (below). With the GT350R 2 seconds ahead of the M5 Competition (below) I would expect an extra 200 hp and 4 year newer car (tires and advancements in the chassis) will make it faster.

Car and Driver's Lightning Lap - U.S. cars to down to BMW M5 Competition

https://www.caranddriver.com/feature...storical-data/

Year Make Model, Lap Time

2017 Ford GT, 2:43.0
2016 Dodge Viper ACR, 2:44.2
2015 Chevrolet Corvette Z06, 2:44.6
2019 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 1LE, 2:45.0
2017 Ford GT, 2:45.5
2018 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1 1LE, 2:45.7
2017 Chevrolet Corvette Grand Sport, 2:47.1
2008 Dodge Viper SRT10 ACR, 2:48.6
2014 SRT Viper TA, 2:49.9
2017 Chevrolet Camaro ZL1, 2:50.1
2012 Chevrolet Corvette ZR1, 2:50.7
2015 Chevrolet Camaro Z/28, 2:50.9
2009 Chevrolet Corvette ZR1, 2:51.8
2016 Ford Mustang Shelby GT350R, 2:51.8
2016 BMW M4 GTS, 2:52.9
2011 Chevrolet Corvette Z06, 2:53.5
2014 Chevrolet Corvette Stingray, 2:53.8
2018 Ford Mustang GT Performance Package Level 2, 2:53.8
2019 BMW M5 Competition, 2:54.0
2018 BMW M5, 2:55.2

[TXSTYLE]

Originally Posted by David70

You think the results would be different on the street? Around a road course?Any proof?

Maybe we are back to the part where we talk about the great daily driver amenities or the soft/strokable dash?

That was funny!

[AlexFL]

Originally Posted by yousefnjr

Here’s a public road for you...

I can guess what the next qualifiers will be

This is a rolling race where initial grip is less relevant.

[nick3753]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

I'll never understand the obsession you yanks have with drag racing times for street cars.

Interesting because lately I feel many of the euro cars are going AWD with automatic transmission with launch control systems to improve their 0-60 times, becoming more about straight line speed with their giant horsepower turbo motors.

[Germanauto]

Originally Posted by Alfisti

I'll never understand the obsession you yanks have with drag racing times for street cars.

To add to obvious reasons, Youtube/social media has made drag racing an even bigger obsession since it generates views/clicks. Viewers don't care a lick about how a car handles or how its steering feels when it's more entertaining to watch some pointless drag race which has no bearing on real world drivability.

[RM7]

The M5 is an amazing car, amazing what they did with that weight to get the grip out of it that they did (in turns). The AWD will launch insanely fast and the torque from that monster will punch you in the guy every time...

But the GT500 is in a different class. Even though they may be drag racing it in the videos, it doesn't give up much on a road course. Every review I've seen of it says it doesn't suck around a course and that it's not a "one trick pony". It's got more power and as we've seen, it can out accelerate the M5. No diss on the M5, that's an amazing car that seats 4 adults no less, but the GT500 is in a different class.

I think the M5 is one of BMWs strong points though, it's as fast as many 2 door performance/sports cars and able to take the family. The Mustang certainly isn't designed for that.

[David70]

Originally Posted by Germanauto

To add to obvious reasons, Youtube/social media has made drag racing an even bigger obsession since it generates views/clicks. Viewers don't care a lick about how a car handles or how its steering feels when it's more entertaining to watch some pointless drag race which has no bearing on real world drivability.

Partly because it removes the variables and is quick and easy to do virtually anywhere. Most can go to a dragstrip on a Saturday night near them, cost is minimal, do a couple of runs and drive home.

Try to have a race on a road course and time and video it. Then who knows if it was the car or the driver. I've watched plenty of road course video where the guy in the slower car keeps up with someone else. It showed me that the issue with the road course is someone's awesome road course car likely has the weak link behind the wheel.

As for reality, a car that goes from 0-60 in 3.5 seconds or 4, 1/4 mile in 11 or 11.5 seconds, or is a second slower around a road course than some other car, then basing a buying decision on this information because you will drive it to work everyday or go on a weekend drive through a canyon somewhere all seems silly to me. The use of the data is best used to impress people.
Interesting to watch videos but really irrelevant information.

[heavyD^2]

I can appreciate how far pony cars have come. The Mustang and Camaro are no longer one trick ponies as in performance trims they are world class handling cars. The M5 isn't far behind, shaming a lot of sports cars itself, and unlike the high performance pony cars can actually be driven daily in all seasons while the GT500 is strictly a summer car. Also the BMW has a level of class and sophistication that isn't even on the radar for the GT500 as it comes with a rotary shifter straight out of the Ford Fusion parts bin and has the same shoddy build quality and panel gaps of a $26k base Mustang rolling out of Flat Rock that would fail QA at a Kia assembly plant. At the end of the day it all comes down to what's important to you as both cars are very good at their intended purposes.

[New2Roundel]

Originally Posted by heavyD^2

The M5 isn't far behind, shaming a lot of sports cars itself, and unlike the high performance pony cars can actually be driven daily in all seasons while the GT500 is strictly a summer car. Also the BMW has a level of class and sophistication that isn't even on the radar for the GT500 as it comes with a rotary shifter straight out of the Ford Fusion parts bin and has the same shoddy build quality and panel gaps of a $26k base Mustang rolling out of Flat Rock that would fail QA at a Kia assembly plant. At the end of the day it all comes down to what's important to you as both cars are very good at their intended purposes.

No doubt this is true. I factory ordered a 2012 Mustang GT back in the day. It was my first quick car. I loved it...for a couple of years. I then sold it for the 2011 M3 in my signature. Both the mustang and M3 were base-trim cars and both had the performance upgrades of the time (brembo package for the stang and comp for the M3). But even in very basic guise, the M3 is a much nicer car even though the performance numbers don't differ by much.

But the reality is that nothing is free. I spent $10k more on the used M3 than I spent on the new mustang. If you want to talk about numbers, that's one thing, but generally comparing a regular performance car to a higher end performance car is not relevant. The M5 should be a much nicer car since the price difference starts at about $30k---and that's for a "slow" M5 w/out comp package. If all you want is performance, the M5 really isn't in the conversation IMO.