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2019+ BMW 3 AND 4-SERIES FORUMS (G2x Generation) Local Forums UK Initial "real world" 330e economy (5 days in...)

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      09-24-2019, 05:06 PM   #1
tricky6
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So, first off, this is my "real world" economy. I tend to do lots of small journeys around home on weekends (3-25 miles per journey), I can charge at home but tend to leave it for overnight when we've got an EV tariff. I have two long journeys in the week (around 380 miles total, mostly on motorways, frequently lots of traffic problems/jams) with lots of small journeys (10-15 miles) during the week between hotel/office/client office. I can charge at my hotel/office + customer (well, apart from today when a fully charged Nissan Leaf was sat in the electric charge spot...hmmm) Also had a petrol car sat in a spot at my hotel but reception sorted out getting it moved... welcome to a new level of worry... :-)

Photo is my MPG/electric usage since fuel fill up on Friday. So, combining a weekend, a 170 mile motorway trip and 2 days of local "small journeys" + a 30 mile meander this evening just going "nowhere" and revelling in electric-ness + a bit of hoofing it :-)

In summary I've covered over half the 264 miles in electric, average is 91.4 MPG. Reckon my Mondeo would be at about 55 MPG at best...

A few caveats. I don't follow the BMW stereotype of sitting in the outside line up someone's backside doing 90 MPH. Once perhaps but not now... I'm the inside lane guy just pottering along, out of the rat race, doing maybe 60-65. I'm still running in so have been fairly gentle. Mostly been in Hybrid Eco Pro with a few Electric only sessions. I've had a few XtraBoost moments but only a few. Have also had some Sport moments to see how that works (maybe 15-20 miles). Made a lot of use of the Driving Assistant and the 330e's general ability to judge/pre-apply braking when approaching roundabouts/junctions. Still trying to work out whether it's based on the vehicle in front slowing down or just sat NAV data... it is uncannily accurate.

So longer term I reckon the 91.4 will come down, when I drive back home later in the week but still, pretty WOW!

Oh, warning if using the 3-pin charger that you get with the car. The 3-pin end can get proper hot so make sure you don't burn yourself when unplugging. Not that I did that this evening, no, not me... :-(

What I like about this is that is dispels' the magazine/press wisdom that PHEV's are only good for people who just do short local journeys. If you're doing 300 miles/day/every day then maybe a 320d would be better but there is no way a 320d would get ANYWHERE near these figures on the same cycle...
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      09-24-2019, 05:58 PM   #2
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Caveat 4 pints of Cider and at a hotel now.
************************************************** ******

I'll admit it Tricky, I'm close to ordering and this is helping a lot!

These figures are outstanding, your journeys seem quite similar to mine, I was very sceptical about the MPG and range but this is very compelling.

For myself I have mellowed somewhat from several M cars, I just cannot be bothered anymore with the noise and running costs.... getting old I know.

In my X3 M40D I'm putting some stellar figures out for this size car....which speaks volumes for my current driving style. Rated 40mpg officially I think, I've just recorded 51mpg from Chester to Hull. My 11,000 mile average is 41mpg, likely amongst the highest of an M40D owner, I just don's seem to do the cars justice, or as likely, the 50mph limits and general 'cannot speed anywhere' roads set the scene now.

I've seen a deal I'm very keen on, ant tips on spec, I might go bare bones and only add the Driver Assistance Package. (I wont but it sounds good for now). Seriously though did you sort any kind of wall box at home, I'm not sure I need to. I have a garage ( car is never in it) and driveway and would just charge overnight...every night.

This would seem ideal for my journey mix in any month:-

- Driveway to any random local places within 10 miles, kids sports, shops etc - Plan is pure EV and charge up every night
- I live in North Wales and once, maybe twice a week travel 46 miles door to door to work in Trafford Park Manchester. I plan to use as much RV| mode as I can or hyrbid one way....now IF I can charge at work too ( cannot currently) that would be incredible. I am 2 minutes walk from the new mega site Williams BMW showroom....can I use their charger for free for a 1/2 day, anyone know the deal with the EV points onsite at a dealers?
- Final option is like today, long trip to a customer literally anywhere in the UK, today N Wales to Hull 155 miles. I expect I'll use hybrid mode to maximise mpg

Apologies again for the long post, just feels like a different step this time...but I'm not sure how I missed how jack of all trades this step to 330e could be, I think it covers the best of both worlds without the crazy looks of i3 and i8..de- badge and it is any G20!

Recap Questions:-

1) Anything essential on a 3303 spec? (Personal I know)?
2) Worth sorting a home wallbox, currently feel like not bothering?
3) Worth buying any charging cables?
4) Worth signing up to any charging subscription service?
5) What was the energy tariff you recommended please, was it 4p/KWH?!

Currently thinking of this for a low spec:-

https://configure.bmw.co.uk/en_GB/configid/s9s8q0n1/G20

Cheers
Chris
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      09-25-2019, 02:55 AM   #3
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Mine is on order, and I have the same standard 'mondeo man' driving patterns you two do.

It's all on paper, but I worked out that, if it reliably does 35mpg on petrol and 35 miles on electric I'm about breakeven with a diesel on fuel, and then factoring company car tax a tonne better off over 20k/year.

Looking at the numbers people are reporting my estimates are low, so I'm pretty excited to see what I get when it arrives in November.

Spec on mine is msport +park assist and driving assistant. Everything else seemed like fluff except adaptive suspension, which I couldn't fit in my lease budget.

As a private buyer I think it's a bit more marginal since you don't have the same tax benefits.

My only reservation is the size of the boot. But the savings in tax are more than the lease on a 3008 for the wife if we decide we need something bigger than this + a polo.
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      09-25-2019, 04:50 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JustChris View Post
Caveat 4 pints of Cider and at a hotel now.
************************************************** ******

I'll admit it Tricky, I'm close to ordering and this is helping a lot!

These figures are outstanding, your journeys seem quite similar to mine, I was very sceptical about the MPG and range but this is very compelling.

For myself I have mellowed somewhat from several M cars, I just cannot be bothered anymore with the noise and running costs.... getting old I know.

In my X3 M40D I'm putting some stellar figures out for this size car....which speaks volumes for my current driving style. Rated 40mpg officially I think, I've just recorded 51mpg from Chester to Hull. My 11,000 mile average is 41mpg, likely amongst the highest of an M40D owner, I just don's seem to do the cars justice, or as likely, the 50mph limits and general 'cannot speed anywhere' roads set the scene now.

I've seen a deal I'm very keen on, ant tips on spec, I might go bare bones and only add the Driver Assistance Package. (I wont but it sounds good for now). Seriously though did you sort any kind of wall box at home, I'm not sure I need to. I have a garage ( car is never in it) and driveway and would just charge overnight...every night.

This would seem ideal for my journey mix in any month:-

- Driveway to any random local places within 10 miles, kids sports, shops etc - Plan is pure EV and charge up every night
- I live in North Wales and once, maybe twice a week travel 46 miles door to door to work in Trafford Park Manchester. I plan to use as much RV| mode as I can or hyrbid one way....now IF I can charge at work too ( cannot currently) that would be incredible. I am 2 minutes walk from the new mega site Williams BMW showroom....can I use their charger for free for a 1/2 day, anyone know the deal with the EV points onsite at a dealers?
- Final option is like today, long trip to a customer literally anywhere in the UK, today N Wales to Hull 155 miles. I expect I'll use hybrid mode to maximise mpg

Apologies again for the long post, just feels like a different step this time...but I'm not sure how I missed how jack of all trades this step to 330e could be, I think it covers the best of both worlds without the crazy looks of i3 and i8..de- badge and it is any G20!

Recap Questions:-

1) Anything essential on a 3303 spec? (Personal I know)?
2) Worth sorting a home wallbox, currently feel like not bothering?
3) Worth buying any charging cables?
4) Worth signing up to any charging subscription service?
5) What was the energy tariff you recommended please, was it 4p/KWH?!

Currently thinking of this for a low spec:-

https://configure.bmw.co.uk/en_GB/configid/s9s8q0n1/G20

Cheers
Chris
Yeah, essential spec is a difficult one. The M Sport is pretty well spec'd out of the box. A long way from my first BMW, a 318i SE back in 1994 that had 6 speakers but no stereo head unit!? :-)

I really like my music so ordered the HK stereo, it's not super awesome (the Mark Levinson stereo in a Lexus ES is better) but it's better than the Sony one in my Mondeo. The Driver Assistant is brilliant, especially if you do lots of motorway miles, basically it drives itself as long as you gently hold the wheel and in stop/start traffic you don't even need to hold the wheel. Makes for relaxing journeys, especially in traffic jams. I went for the M Sport Plus pack mainly to get adaptive suspension (having tried a 320d M Sport which I found much too firm), I don't think the M Sport 330e has M Sport suspension so no idea what the standard ride is like. Definitely get a test drive before you order, guessing dealers should have 330e's available now for demo. Adaptive is still comfortable even in Sport mode. Very clever considering 19" wheels and elastic band run flat tyres. Also I like the look of the M Sport + detailing (black grill etc.) :-)

I noticed that some options are only available on the M Sport, Driver Assistant being one of them. Originally I was thinking of getting a 330e SE Pro as that is meant to be 8% BIK from next year but there was virtually no difference in the lease costs (about £10/month) and lack of DA and looks of the M Sport+ swung it...

Only other things I went for were storage pack (adds 2 x rear USB-C, a couple of 12v cigar sockets, + seat nets and, wait for it....a really cheap looking plastic "bag hook" in the boot. Wooo!) and the oak open pour wood trim as I thought the standard M Sport "fake metal" looked a bit naff. And that was my lease budget limit hit! I do miss keyless entry having had it for the last 11 years on all my cars and also wish I had a sunroof to let a bit of light in. Don't particularly miss electric seats. The manual ones adjust everywhichway. I didn't bother with the lumbar support either, I find the seats a lot firmer than my Mondeo but still comfortable on a long journey.

Definitely recommend checking out the boot before purchase. It really is quite small, mostly height-wise. Once I've sold my Mondeo we'll be left with the 330e and my wife's Golf so no longer have anything to carry large loads. Will get a roof-box for holidays/weekends away but I'm sure we'll miss the Mondeo's space at times...

On your other questions:

1. I went for a (7Kw) home charger from ChargeMaster, cost about £450 (inclusive of £500 Government grant). It works fine but the mobile app is a bit rubbish. It cuts the charge time from 5 hours down to 3.5. Annoying that the 330e only takes 3.6Kw charge!? Ended up getting a socket unit rather than tethered as I have a long run from the unit to my car. The car comes with a 3-pin charging unit. A 10m type-2 cable cost £210 (I used https://evconnectors.com, good service, product seems high quality). You will likely need a cable when out and about, most charge points are socket only.
2. I've signed up to Ecotricity, Polar and Evchargeonline. Ecotricity is PAYG, Polar has a monthly subscription but it's free for the first 3 months (they send you an RFID key fob thing). So far I've tried Ecotricity on the motorway and it didn't work (cable wouldn't stay plugged in). The two other public points I've used have been free. One in the town where I live (still need an account with EVchargeonline to activate the charge) and one at a multi-storey in Swindon (just plug in and charge). My current hotel (Best Western) has two sockets (one 3-pin and one type 2), also free. The Holiday Inn I sometimes stay at has a Polar unit but haven't used it yet. A few friends with EV's signed up to lots of schemes when they got their cars but don't really use them. I may end up the same but so far it hasn't cost me anything...
3. The EV tariff we have is with Octopus Energy. It's 5p/kWhr for off peak (between 0:30 and 04:30). The standing charge is slightly higher than we were on (25p/day rather than 18p) but as long as you're charging it regularly it easily pays for itself. You can use the Connected Drive app to schedule the charge during this period, works perfectly. I posted a link to Octopus in a previous post, with details of their plan, including a referral offer where you get £50 credit and I would too. We've been a customer for over a year now, they've been excellent and they will fit a smart meter for free if you need it (mandatory for the EV tariff, we already had one).

Hope this helps! Just shout if you've got any other questions...
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      09-25-2019, 04:51 AM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jebk View Post
Mine is on order, and I have the same standard 'mondeo man' driving patterns you two do.

It's all on paper, but I worked out that, if it reliably does 35mpg on petrol and 35 miles on electric I'm about breakeven with a diesel on fuel, and then factoring company car tax a tonne better off over 20k/year.

Looking at the numbers people are reporting my estimates are low, so I'm pretty excited to see what I get when it arrives in November.

Spec on mine is msport +park assist and driving assistant. Everything else seemed like fluff except adaptive suspension, which I couldn't fit in my lease budget.

As a private buyer I think it's a bit more marginal since you don't have the same tax benefits.

My only reservation is the size of the boot. But the savings in tax are more than the lease on a 3008 for the wife if we decide we need something bigger than this + a polo.
Definitely check out the boot size, it really isn't that big, especially height-wise. Happy to take a few photos if it helps?
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      09-25-2019, 07:41 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky6 View Post
Definitely check out the boot size, it really isn't that big, especially height-wise. Happy to take a few photos if it helps?
Thanks, someone else posted some on another thread, and yeah, it's pretty small. The wife is due a new one about a month after I get mine and I quite like either a 3008 or the c3 aircross.

What's the regen braking like? Can you do it off the gear lever/paddles or is it all on the brake pedal?
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      09-25-2019, 07:49 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky6 View Post
Definitely check out the boot size, it really isn't that big, especially height-wise. Happy to take a few photos if it helps?
interestingly, the reported boot size is just few liters smaller than my current Mondeo Hybrid boot
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      09-25-2019, 08:24 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jebk View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky6 View Post
Definitely check out the boot size, it really isn't that big, especially height-wise. Happy to take a few photos if it helps?
Thanks, someone else posted some on another thread, and yeah, it's pretty small. The wife is due a new one about a month after I get mine and I quite like either a 3008 or the c3 aircross.

What's the regen braking like? Can you do it off the gear lever/paddles or is it all on the brake pedal?
I think they've done a good job with the brakes, apart from the last 5 mph it's just like a normal car. Even coming to a standstill it's nowhere near as snatchy as other hybrids I've driven, with a bit of practice you can stop it very smoothly. One thing it does seem to do is anticipate you needing to slow down at junctions and roundabouts and will automatically apply some regen braking even if you don't touch the brakes. It doesn't always do it. Not sure if it does this based on the Sat Nav data or recognising the car in front slowing down (it does it even when DA is switched off). I've not tried tinkering with the paddles but I think that would just use the engine to slow down, not regen. I'll try it on my way home and see if it fires up the engine...
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      09-25-2019, 05:58 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tricky6 View Post
I think they've done a good job with the brakes, apart from the last 5 mph it's just like a normal car. Even coming to a standstill it's nowhere near as snatchy as other hybrids I've driven, with a bit of practice you can stop it very smoothly. One thing it does seem to do is anticipate you needing to slow down at junctions and roundabouts and will automatically apply some regen braking even if you don't touch the brakes. It doesn't always do it. Not sure if it does this based on the Sat Nav data or recognising the car in front slowing down (it does it even when DA is switched off). I've not tried tinkering with the paddles but I think that would just use the engine to slow down, not regen. I'll try it on my way home and see if it fires up the engine...
Hopefully it regens. I drove a Hyundai ioniq phev as a loaner for a while that you could really turn the regen up on and it was awesome. Had it a week and barely touched the brake.
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      09-26-2019, 03:34 AM   #10
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Hopefully it regens. I drove a Hyundai ioniq phev as a loaner for a while that you could really turn the regen up on and it was awesome. Had it a week and barely touched the brake.
it regens and you can clearly feel it when you lift off the acelerator, but you cannot control how much it regens with the paddles, when you press the paddle the engine kicks in.
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      09-26-2019, 05:31 AM   #11
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it regens and you can clearly feel it when you lift off the acelerator, but you cannot control how much it regens with the paddles, when you press the paddle the engine kicks in.
Makes sense. No experience, but surely the paddle is the last thing to use, if you want regenerative braking, not instigate engine braking.

Do you find you have changed your driving style? More complete throttle lift off to maximise regeneration?
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      09-26-2019, 08:21 AM   #12
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Not really, I always anticipated a lot when driving, so for me is totally normal to release the accelerator early if I see that I will have to stop ahead, in the 330e , since it regenerates when off the accelerator, I just have to release it later than in a normal car, but I like it this way, because I use the brakes a lot less frequently.

One thing I notice in this car which is really impressive, is that since it has the batteries in the back, the traction is unbelievable, it feels like a awd car, I can floor it mid corner and it just grips and goes, totally different from the ///M cars I owned and driven, in which is almost impossible to touch the throttle mid corner without the rear moving a lot, or the TC kicking in hard. The 330e feels super stable and safe.
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      09-26-2019, 09:25 AM   #13
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Makes sense. No experience, but surely the paddle is the last thing to use, if you want regenerative braking, not instigate engine braking.
Some EV's and PHEVs you can use the paddles to activate Higher/Lower levels of Energy Regen. Not used but sounds odd, I'm sure once using its simple.
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      09-26-2019, 09:27 AM   #14
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Not really, I always anticipated a lot when driving, so for me is totally normal to release the accelerator early if I see that I will have to stop ahead, in the 330e , since it regenerates when off the accelerator, I just have to release it later than in a normal car, but I like it this way, because I use the brakes a lot less frequently.

One thing I notice in this car which is really impressive, is that since it has the batteries in the back, the traction is unbelievable, it feels like a awd car, I can floor it mid corner and it just grips and goes, totally different from the ///M cars I owned and driven, in which is almost impossible to touch the throttle mid corner without the rear moving a lot, or the TC kicking in hard. The 330e feels super stable and safe.
I was thinking last night about winter and that old BMW adage about a light, high power, rear wheel drive car. Probably no longer that light and its nicely over the rear now, pretty handy.
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      09-26-2019, 10:26 AM   #15
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First day, collected the car this morning, drove 50 miles back to Edinburgh and now charging via a three pin socket.

The app on the iPhone works well.
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      09-26-2019, 10:29 AM   #16
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I was thinking last night about winter and that old BMW adage about a light, high power, rear wheel drive car. Probably no longer that light and its nicely over the rear now, pretty handy.
it is definitely not light at 1800 kg, but since the added weight is in the rear of the car and very low to the ground, it gives the car the advantage of the added traction
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      09-26-2019, 01:27 PM   #17
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First day, collected the car this morning, drove 50 miles back to Edinburgh and now charging via a three pin socket.

The app on the iPhone works well.
Glad you’ve finally got it! What’s up with the brake fluid warning!?
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      09-26-2019, 01:29 PM   #18
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Good to see Blackers, that's a little annoying the dealer PDI hasn't cleared or reset a service warning there, hopefully something they could sort over the air maybe for you to avoid a trip back
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      09-26-2019, 01:34 PM   #19
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Whay you have the Brake fluid 2001? my sailers car have the same problem with same thing.
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      09-26-2019, 02:48 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackers View Post
First day, collected the car this morning, drove 50 miles back to Edinburgh and now charging via a three pin socket.

The app on the iPhone works well.
Glad you've finally got it! What's up with the brake fluid warning!?
Thanks Tricky, glad to finally have it 😊, had an enjoyable drive back from Stirling.

Dropping into the dealer in Edinburgh tomorrow to get the fault fixed, it can't be done remotely, they were apologetic and say it will be a quick thing to fix. Not sure but looks like they have entered a date in correctly, 12/2001 is when the brake fluid needs to be changed according to the car, perhaps it should be 12/2021? When is yours due?
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      09-26-2019, 05:37 PM   #21
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Thanks Tricky, glad to finally have it 😊, had an enjoyable drive back from Stirling.

Dropping into the dealer in Edinburgh tomorrow to get the fault fixed, it can't be done remotely, they were apologetic and say it will be a quick thing to fix. Not sure but looks like they have entered a date in correctly, 12/2001 is when the brake fluid needs to be changed according to the car, perhaps it should be 12/2021? When is yours due?
Someone didn’t do a very good job on the PDI. I’m sure a nice 3-series key ring would be nice ;-)

What are your first impressions after a 50 mile drive? I’m now up to about 400 miles and am still constantly amazed at how bloody good it is. I’ve 99% just been pottering around in Hybrid Eco Pro mode this week with charges at my hotel/office/customer site. Compared to my c300h (with 30 HP electric motor) it’s like chalk and cheese. In the Merc i’d struggle to get to 15 MPH before the engine cut in (with a diesel-y clatter) but in the 330e it’s easy to drive normally without the engine ever cutting in, even in Hybrid mode when it only has about 70hp available. It still gets from 0-30 pretty well. And if the engine does cut you don’t even hear or feel it. Interesting that in Electric mode it gives you a chunk more power (I’m guessing the full 111hp)?

Just wish they’d fitted a 3 digit MPG gauge. Since refuel I’m now just on 99.9 having covered about 300 miles... No idea whether I’m at 100.1 or 150...

This is my Service Display:
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      09-27-2019, 04:04 AM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blackers View Post
Thanks Tricky, glad to finally have it 😊, had an enjoyable drive back from Stirling.

Dropping into the dealer in Edinburgh tomorrow to get the fault fixed, it can't be done remotely, they were apologetic and say it will be a quick thing to fix. Not sure but looks like they have entered a date in correctly, 12/2001 is when the brake fluid needs to be changed according to the car, perhaps it should be 12/2021? When is yours due?
I have the same problem with the brake fluid warning, I have to go to the dealer so they can fix it, seems like it is common
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