[Greer]

Hi Guys,

I am getting an M2 Competition this weekend. The deal quoted me seems high. Here are the numbers, what do you think:

2019 Bmw M2 Competition 3.0 L, automatic, Hockenheim Silver Metallic, Black Dakota Leather with blue stitching, Executive Package, M Double-clutch Transmission wi... view details

Price $64,545

$2500 total down 36mo lease with 10k miles per/year $1127.88 plus tax $1235.03 include tax.

The money factor 0.00188 and residual 10k at 48%.

[chris719]

Well, the residual sucks, but not much you can do about that.

The money factor seems mediocre, but I am not sure what BMW FS base numbers are this month. 0.00188 is about a 4.5% rate.

All M2 Competitions are bad lease deals with these residuals.

[aerokubectl]

If you don't plan on buying the car and can't write off the lease with a business, it's probably bad. The only thing you gain is risk mitigation.

If you plan on leasing and dumping after 3 years I would probably suggest you get something with a better residual.

[ddnmkun]

Originally Posted by spetsnazos

If you plan on leasing and dumping after 3 years I would probably suggest you get something with a better residual.

Like those M3s, really good leasing deal comparatively, especially those unsold 2018 models.

[Greer]

Originally Posted by spetsnazos

I would probably suggest you get something with a better residual.

I only want an M2 Comp, so for that car is this in line what other people are paying for a 2019 lease? Thx.

[aerokubectl]

Originally Posted by Greer

I only want an M2 Comp, so for that car is this in line what other people are paying for a 2019 lease? Thx.

Yes that's pretty close to what most people are paying.

Look at the more intelligent lease threads and you'll see there are tons of pros to leasing even with a high payment such as this.

- low residual means you buy the car for a lot less at the end of the lease
- bmw takes all the risk during the lease. If the value plummits because you got into a car accident and insurance paid like 30k to fix it.
- you can easily use the write off as a business expense


Reasons not to lease an M2C
- you plan to 100% swap for another car in 3 years
- you can't write the payment off at all
- you like parting with your money immediately

[nomoracin]

Originally Posted by spetsnazos

Yes that's pretty close to what most people are paying.

Look at the more intelligent lease threads and you'll see there are tons of pros to leasing even with a high payment such as this.

- low residual means you buy the car for a lot less at the end of the lease
- bmw takes all the risk during the lease. If the value plummits because you got into a car accident and insurance paid like 30k to fix it.
- you can easily use the write off as a business expense


Reasons not to lease an M2C
- you plan to 100% swap for another car in 3 years
- you can't write the payment off at all
- you like parting with your money immediately

That's an interesting way to look at leasing regarding low residual...buying the car for a lot less! hmmm...food for thought for the next time I'm in the market for a new vehicle. Thanks!

[Transfer]

You can finance for 60 mo at that same interest rate and down payment for basically the exact monthly payment as that lease. That's a crap lease but normal for M2C. Just finance it unless you don't want the depreciation risk. You can get a better interest rate as well.

[Fear-Mongrel]

Originally Posted by Greer

Hi Guys,

I am getting an M2 Competition this weekend. The deal quoted me seems high. Here are the numbers, what do you think:

2019 Bmw M2 Competition 3.0 L, automatic, Hockenheim Silver Metallic, Black Dakota Leather with blue stitching, Executive Package, M Double-clutch Transmission wi... view details

Price $64,545

$2500 total down 36mo lease with 10k miles per/year $1127.88 plus tax $1235.03 include tax.

The money factor 0.00188 and residual 10k at 48%.

Nothing wrong with that money factor, viewed against current rates. The Fed Funds rate went up to 2.5% as of December and that .00188 MF equates to 4.512%, so you're just over 200BP above Fed Funds and right in line with current refi rates. I don't know what BMWFS's current base MF is, but I suspect your dealer is giving you the base rate and not marking it up at all - if that's the case, good for you. Viewed against some of the promo rates of recent times - "GMAC Financing at 0% for 84 months" or Mazda's virtual-zero MF last summer - that MF may seem high but it isn't when viewed against the current yield curve and expectations of additional rate hikes this year.

As chris719 mentioned, nothing you can do about the residual. BMW will sell every M2C it can build so unlike the 3-series and other models sitting on dealer lots BMW doesn't have to create additional incentives - or eat additional risk - to move the M2C.

The only change I'd recommend without having more details is to eliminate the down payment - keep that $2500 in your pocket, or put it in a savings account to augment your monthly payment each month if the payment amount is a concern. If you have an accident or the car is stolen, the gap insurance provided by BMWFS will simply pay the "gap" between what you still owe on the car and what the totaled car is worth but your down payment disappears. You don't get that back. No point in risking that money, especially with interest rates so historically low - the finance charge you will pay on that $2500 you're not putting down is trivial compared to the risk of total forfeiture of the $2500 in case of accident or theft.

Originally Posted by nomoracin

That's an interesting way to look at leasing regarding low residual...buying the car for a lot less! hmmm...food for thought for the next time I'm in the market for a new vehicle. Thanks!

As spetsnazos smartly highlights, this is a point too many people miss. The lower residual means the lease buyout is lower - that means a smaller check you have to write in three years if you love and want to keep the car. Yes, you've been paying more for the first three years of ownership via a higher lease payment, but that money comes back to you via a lower buyout if you purchase the car from BMW. That's why you'll see people who have some expectation of buying the car are less concerned with a lower residual - they know they'll see that money come back to them in three years. The other side of this is the person who knows with 100% certainty they will be handing the keys over to BMW in three years - the low residual is bad for them because they're creating a situation where they're handing BMW the keys to a car that is worth more than is owed in a buyout. They are paying extra for 3 years and giving BMW the benefit of that extra money (minus the risk BMW always accepts with a lease, the risk that you have an accident that doesn't total the car but dramatically diminishes the value and they get handed the keys to a car which is worth much less than the value they have assumed).

For those new to leasing - we were all new to it at some point - think of a car lease as a big apple pie cut into two portions. Portion 1 is for the term of the lease, say years 1-3. Portion 2 is the residual, that's for years 4-End of Life of the pie/car (EOL). Your lease payment is based on the portion of pie BMW wants you to pay for over years 1-3 (plus a finance charge), and the residual is what they think the pie will be worth for years 4-EOL. So if the residual is 60%, that means BMW wants you to pay for 40% of the cost of the pie over three years, and they'll assume that last 60%. This is why people bemoan low residuals, for example BMW's current 48% on the M2C. Who wants to pay 52% of the cost for 3 years of pie, when BMW only wants to be responsible for 48% of the pie and they get the car for years 4-EOL. For people who are sure they only want three years of pie, and in three years they want to switch to tiramisu and get an Alfa Quadrifoglio, it makes no sense to pay such a large portion of the pie. But if you have a reasonable expectation that you will keep the car beyond the lease that means you will inevitably be eating 100% of the pie. So you will pay for 100% of the pie. The only thing that has happened with BMW's low residual in that case is that you've paid for more of the pie in years 1-3 and less for years 4-EOL. You're still paying for 100% of the pie, you're just shifting a larger portion of that cost to years 1-3 and away from years 4-EOL. And yes, you do pay finance costs on that larger portion, but right now we're enjoying historically low interest rates - abnormally low interest rates that inevitably must normalize. So if you're going to pay a finance cost, you're at the right time in history to do doing so.

Of course, this explanation is more appropriate here on the M2 forum where enthusiasts do keep the cars for longer periods. If this were a Hyundai Elantra forum, where cars might be more frequently treated like disposable razors and dumped quickly, fewer people would probably care about Elantra pie in years 4-EOL.

[CSBM5]

How about a zero down $899/mo on a new M3 CS with a >$100k MSRP, lol.

http://www.swapalease.com/lease/deta...?salid=1329142

[Poochie]

Originally Posted by CSBM5

How about a zero down $899/mo on a new M3 CS with a >$100k MSRP, lol.

http://www.swapalease.com/lease/deta...?salid=1329142

That's sweet! The insurance will cost another $100 a month, so for $1,000 OTD, you'll be pushing a new M3 CS, which you could walk away from, in three years, scott free..

You could be hood-rich and still be comfortable with that flat, rounded monthly payment.
Before you look at the semantics, always factor in the human cost of peace of mind that leasing affords. The fact that you avoid having to haggle a trade-in, after you're done with the car is priceless to me.

Leases can work to your advantage if you play your cards right..

Also, keep in mind that leases cost more now because the money factor is higher due to overall base Federal interest rate increase. Not all BMW greed.

[Greer]

Originally Posted by CSBM5

How about a zero down $899/mo on a new M3 CS
[/URL]

I only want an M2 Competition. I just want to make sure other people who have recently leased this car have payments in the same ballpark as I was quoted. Thx.

[StavsM2C]

Originally Posted by Greer

I only want an M2 Competition. I just want to make sure other people who have recently leased this car have payments in the same ballpark as I was quoted. Thx.

Just purchase it man! I work for BMW and I would never lease this car as the FAKE residuals drive these cars away from leases and I also don't foresee values plummeting and you can get aggressive rates for 60 months in the mid 3% range. Also the Money factor is .00188 and best BMW rate is 2.89% up to 60 months or 3.89% up to 72 months.

Top tier 84 months are like 3.94% at my local credit unions. Let me know if you have any questions!

Buy it and enjoy it man!

[M4 GTS]

Originally Posted by Greer

I only want an M2 Competition. I just want to make sure other people who have recently leased this car have payments in the same ballpark as I was quoted. Thx.

Probably the same. You can't change residual and there is no incentives. That's why I purchased mine.

[doug_999]

Don't lease a M2 or M2C. Even if you own a business - talk to your accountant how depreciation write-offs work and you will see, that you will save money buying the car even if you do plan on writing it off through your business.

and..
The lower residual being beneficial to purchasing at the end.... that's just funny.

Run the payments, talk to your accountant, don't lease this car. Period.

[Orange fever]

Am I reading that screen name right? what the heck !!!flashback from the past...lol
Hey brotha ///
The payment is right....
Ask how I know

[Greer]

Originally Posted by Orange fever

Am I reading that screen name right? what the heck !!!flashback from the past...lol
Hey brotha ///
The payment is right....
Ask how I know

How do you know the payment is right?

[aerokubectl]

Originally Posted by doug_999

Don't lease a M2 or M2C. Even if you own a business - talk to your accountant how depreciation write-offs work and you will see, that you will save money buying the car even if you do plan on writing it off through your business.

and..
The lower residual being beneficial to purchasing at the end.... that's just funny.

Run the payments, talk to your accountant, don't lease this car. Period.

I did talk to my accountant.

How is it that you will save money by buying the car? Show me the math.

[infinitekidM2C]

This thread reads like "Hi guys am i getting ripped off too badly or just right?"

[Orange fever]

Originally Posted by Greer

How do you know the payment is right?

On my OG m2 that's what I'm paying. 2nd one in the dealership. Back in 2016 with no wait , no list.
Just had a good SA.
Was going to trade in for the s55 m2..same payment as my OG m2 with zero down.
So I'm going to wait for the m2csl...

[Greer]

Originally Posted by infinitekidM2C

This thread reads like "Hi guys am i getting ripped off too badly or just right?"

This site is where the best M2 information is and that's why I asked.

[arrivederci]

Originally Posted by StavsM2C

Just purchase it man! I work for BMW and I would never lease this car as the FAKE residuals drive these cars away from leases and I also don't foresee values plummeting and you can get aggressive rates for 60 months in the mid 3% range. Also the Money factor is .00188 and best BMW rate is 2.89% up to 60 months or 3.89% up to 72 months.

Top tier 84 months are like 3.94% at my local credit unions. Let me know if you have any questions!

Buy it and enjoy it man!

I originally wanted to lease and have the peace of mind to turn it in after 3 years if I was ready to move on (or buy it out). But with that residual I think I'd be throwing away some real equity if I turned it in. Seems like BMW does not want to lease the M2C. Its a shame because we just turned in a 328d wagon and have substantial mileage credits that could be applied to another BMW. I'm headed over to the BMW dealer tomorrow to see what my M2C options are with those mileage credits as well as trading my X5M.