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      08-05-2018, 05:13 PM   #1
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How Do I Disable Both Dynamic Stability Control (DSC) and Traction Control (DTC)

I'll be going to the track in a couple of weeks, and my reading of the manual indicates that while DSC can be disabled, doing so enables DTC.

Does anyone know if both DSC and DTC can be disabled at the same time; if so, what's the sequence for making this happen?
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      08-05-2018, 06:09 PM   #2
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
I'll be going to the track in a couple of weeks, and my reading of the manual indicates that while DSC can be disabled, doing so enables DTC.

Does anyone know if both DSC and DTC can be disabled at the same time; if so, what's the sequence for making this happen?
Single press DTC ON
Hold button 5 seconds DSC OFF

If you never driven on a track. Better stay with DTC ON (single press). Chances are it will never really intervine and if you really screw up it will save your butt
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      08-05-2018, 06:29 PM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pikcachu View Post
Single press DTC ON
Hold button 5 seconds DSC OFF

If you never driven on a track. Better stay with DTC ON (single press). Chances are it will never really intervine and if you really screw up it will save your butt
First, thank you very much for replying, as I'm a bit lost here in terms of how to get a modern car to let me be the only software driving it.

I hate to appear as slow as I really am here, but...

1) Single press DTC ON = single press of the DSC button, right?

On page 122, the manual says that this activates DTC, displays 'TRACTION' in the instrument cluster, and the indicator light for 'DSC OFF' lights up, too. I take this to mean that DSC is OFF and DTC is ON - is this accurate, so far?

2) Hold button 5 seconds DSC OFF = hold DSC button down for 5 seconds?

Also on page 122, the manual says that doing this until 'DSC OFF' lights up in the instrument cluster switches DSC to OFF. But the instrument cluster already says 'DSC OFF', doesn't it? (I don't have the car at the moment, so I can't follow your instructions directly.)

-------------

I've been to the track a fair amount. I'm much more concerned with the car trying to "help me" than I am with my ability to not f**k it up by over-driving the car. Plus, this will be my first time on the track in a street car in many years, so I'll just be tippy-toeing around the track finding out what the new suspension, wheels and tires, and diff will let me do - and not do!
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      08-05-2018, 07:26 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
First, thank you very much for replying, as I'm a bit lost here in terms of how to get a modern car to let me be the only software driving it.

I hate to appear as slow as I really am here, but...

1) Single press DTC ON = single press of the DSC button, right?

On page 122, the manual says that this activates DTC, displays 'TRACTION' in the instrument cluster, and the indicator light for 'DSC OFF' lights up, too. I take this to mean that DSC is OFF and DTC is ON - is this accurate, so far?

2) Hold button 5 seconds DSC OFF = hold DSC button down for 5 seconds?

Also on page 122, the manual says that doing this until 'DSC OFF' lights up in the instrument cluster switches DSC to OFF. But the instrument cluster already says 'DSC OFF', doesn't it? (I don't have the car at the moment, so I can't follow your instructions directly.)

-------------

I've been to the track a fair amount. I'm much more concerned with the car trying to "help me" than I am with my ability to not f**k it up by over-driving the car. Plus, this will be my first time on the track in a street car in many years, so I'll just be tippy-toeing around the track finding out what the new suspension, wheels and tires, and diff will let me do - and not do!
yes, you press DSC button

one thing is the yellow icon of the car with wavy marks that lights up when you do either DTC on or DSC off... the other is the "DSC OFF" on the right dial



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      08-05-2018, 09:59 PM   #5
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As above
Single press = Traction mode
Hold it down = DSC off.
Changing to Sport plus will have the same level of assists as traction mode but different settings for driveline etc.
See the handy chart below which is mostly correct.

I've tried both on track and found Traction/sport+ suprisingly unintrusive.

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      08-05-2018, 10:27 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nugget View Post
As above
Single press = Traction mode
Hold it down = DSC off.
Changing to Sport plus will have the same level of assists as traction mode but different settings for driveline etc.
See the handy chart below which is mostly correct.

I've tried both on track and found Traction/sport+ suprisingly unintrusive.
Thanks for the chart - that's the sort of thing that is useful to a newbie like myself - picture being worth more than a thousand words and all that.

Do you know what happens if I first go into Sport+ mode, and then hold down the DSC OFF button for 5-10 seconds? Does that give me the responsiveness of Sport+, as well as no Dynamic Stability Control, and no Dynamic Traction Control?
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      08-05-2018, 10:39 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
Thanks for the chart - that's the sort of thing that is useful to a newbie like myself - picture being worth more than a thousand words and all that.

Do you know what happens if I first go into Sport+ mode, and then hold down the DSC OFF button for 5-10 seconds? Does that give me the responsiveness of Sport+, as well as no Dynamic Stability Control, and no Dynamic Traction Control?
No.. Sport+ and DSC OFF are like different modes altogether...

if you are in sport+ and hold button for 5 secs then you switch to DSC OFF mode... if you click sport button twice then you go to Sport +
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      08-06-2018, 09:29 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pikcachu View Post
No.. Sport+ and DSC OFF are like different modes altogether...

if you are in sport+ and hold button for 5 secs then you switch to DSC OFF mode... if you click sport button twice then you go to Sport +
For the track, do I want to be in Sport+ mode after I have turned both DSC & DTC OFF via:

"Single press DTC ON
Hold button 5 seconds DSC OFF"?

For example, the chart shows 'Sport' engine mapping in Sport & Sport+ modes. That seems like something that would be beneficial on the track.
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      08-06-2018, 10:20 AM   #9
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IIRC, DSCoff reverts you to non-sport for throttle sensitivity (aka 'engine mapping' - sport/sport+ never really change a/t but the throttle responsiveness) but if you have other sport-related changes like chassis/shock settings I think those stay at sport mode. I think the logic is that on track you are better off with a more linear throttle (personally, I like mine in sport mode, but I'm such a newbie I'm nowhere close to outdriving the nannies). And I think that after all the other aids are turned off, you are left with the electronic LSD, unless you've coded that out.
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      08-06-2018, 10:44 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maynard View Post
...the electronic LSD, unless you've coded that out.
I've had a LSD installed. Can the electronic LSD be coded out, and what's the difference between leaving it on and coding it out?
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      08-06-2018, 11:43 AM   #11
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I think eLSD can be disabled, but I'm not into coding and just going on what I've seen over time - I think there is a good thread about all the nannies/aids and how to disable them in the coding section (surprising number of these for braking, not just Anti-lock and traction control). IIRC there is still some debate about whether they have already turned yours off when they installed the mechanical LSD, so first step might be calling the dealership that did the work (I can't see why they would NOT disable eLSD after installation, but recently read s/b who thought it was still active on theirs after the install).
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      08-06-2018, 03:28 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
For the track, do I want to be in Sport+ mode after I have turned both DSC & DTC OFF via:

"Single press DTC ON
Hold button 5 seconds DSC OFF"?

For example, the chart shows 'Sport' engine mapping in Sport & Sport+ modes. That seems like something that would be beneficial on the track.
Your are not understanding...

Sport +, DSC OFF, DTC ON are modes on it's own....
there is no such thing as Disable DSC OFF and then also be in Sport+

You are either in COMFORT, SPORT, SPORT+, DTC ON or DSC OFF...

for the track just drive in Sport+
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      08-06-2018, 06:26 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pikcachu View Post
Your are not understanding...

Sport +, DSC OFF, DTC ON are modes on it's own....
there is no such thing as Disable DSC OFF and then also be in Sport+

You are either in COMFORT, SPORT, SPORT+, DTC ON or DSC OFF...

for the track just drive in Sport+
Yes, not understanding...I know!

Okay, all are modes of their own - it's good to understand this. Thank you for making it clear.

I've been told by a BMW shop owner & racer that I'm going to find DTC much too intrusive, but since you and Nugget have suggested otherwise I'll try Sport+ mode to see if DTC comes on.
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Last edited by dradernh; 08-06-2018 at 06:42 PM..
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      08-06-2018, 07:39 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
Yes, not understanding...I know!

Okay, all are modes of their own - it's good to understand this. Thank you for making it clear.

I've been told by a BMW shop owner & racer that I'm going to find DTC much too intrusive, but since you and Nugget have suggested otherwise I'll try Sport+ mode to see if DTC comes on.


Yeah... start in sport+.... if you see the light flashing like a Christmas tree on every turn then you go to DSC OFF... or change the way you drive

Also if you have an LSD then it's even less likely the DTC light will engage
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      08-06-2018, 08:23 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
I've been told by a BMW shop owner & racer that I'm going to find DTC much too intrusive, but since you and Nugget have suggested otherwise I'll try Sport+ mode to see if DTC comes on.
Depends how you drive, if you are smooth you won't notice much DTC interference in Sport+, but it is still there.
If it bothers you then you will have to go to DSC OFF and live with the less aggresive throttle mapping. Which is better anyway in my opinion.
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      08-06-2018, 11:02 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pikcachu View Post
Your are not understanding...

Sport +, DSC OFF, DTC ON are modes on it's own....
there is no such thing as Disable DSC OFF and then also be in Sport+

You are either in COMFORT, SPORT, SPORT+, DTC ON or DSC OFF...

for the track just drive in Sport+
I like Sport+ for track, EXCEPT for the 'fast' throttle. I find I have a hard time controlling throttle and tend to overcook corner exits. So, I'm sort of stuck between DSC OFF or Sport/Chassis.

DSC OFF works great on short/slow autocross tracks. But the total lack of stability control scares me on big fast tracks. (Still a noob and don't want to go nuts.)

Or I run in Sport/Chassis on fast tracks, but then I get too much traction control on corner exit, even with the LSD, and it restricts my exit throttle too much. I want a bit of tail slide/loose, but not too much.

I've read through every thread on this topic, and looked through all the charts, and I just can't find an equivalent to Sport+ with slow throttle.

DTC ON doesn't do it for track either, as the chassis/steering stays soft. (DTC ON is great fun in the snow.)

REALLY wish we could set each of these values independently.
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      08-06-2018, 11:11 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ggggbmw View Post
I like Sport+ for track, EXCEPT for the 'fast' throttle. I find I have a hard time controlling throttle and tend to overcook corner exits. So, I'm sort of stuck between DSC OFF or Sport/Chassis.

DSC OFF works great on short/slow autocross tracks. But the total lack of stability control scares me on big fast tracks. (Still a noob and don't want to go nuts.)

Or I run in Sport/Chassis on fast tracks, but then I get too much traction control on corner exit, even with the LSD, and it restricts my exit throttle too much. I want a bit of tail slide/loose, but not too much.

I've read through every thread on this topic, and looked through all the charts, and I just can't find an equivalent to Sport+ with slow throttle.

DTC ON doesn't do it for track either, as the chassis/steering stays soft. (DTC ON is great fun in the snow.)

REALLY wish we could set each of these values independently.
yeah... you can't do sport+ without sport throttle.... only DSC OFF but then you are on your own....

DTC will save your butt.... specially if you happen to have to drive on a wet track....
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      08-07-2018, 07:22 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nugget View Post
Depends how you drive, if you are smooth you won't notice much DTC interference in Sport+, but it is still there.
If it bothers you then you will have to go to DSC OFF and live with the less aggresive throttle mapping. Which is better anyway in my opinion.
I meant to ask you...where did you get the chart you posted? That's the sort of thing that our manuals ought to have in them; instead, my manual has very little on this subject.
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      08-07-2018, 08:03 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dradernh View Post
I meant to ask you...where did you get the chart you posted? That's the sort of thing that our manuals ought to have in them; instead, my manual has very little on this subject.
Baby BMW forums.
Specifically this thread
http://www.babybmw.net/forum/viewtop...4fb25e5b8b49f1
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      08-09-2018, 10:55 AM   #20
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Drive with DSC off... Sport+ still has nannies on and with your experience level, you don't want any of the nannies on. I made the mistake of assuming that the nannies would be smart enough to out-drive me but I was wrong. It's a major crutch. In Sport +, the throttle response is so abrupt that it really tough to get a good linear power delivery. Yes, the eLSD can be coded off. Knowing some of your background, run DSC off and don't look back.
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      08-09-2018, 07:50 PM   #21
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I am taking the m235i to an autocross this weekend, and gald I came across this thread. My plan is to initially run with DSC Off. I dont think the difference in throttle response in that environment will outweigh the likelihood that DTC would be kicking in at times.

We shall see.

Seemed like a good place to go hoon this car. I typically track a sorted e36 m3. Prior to that, an e30. The f22 is the daily driver, but I wanted to go push it a little, but not at the track, as I prefer having the security that the cage/seats/harness, etc give in my e36.
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      08-09-2018, 11:47 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DaveCN View Post
I am taking the m235i to an autocross this weekend, and gald I came across this thread. My plan is to initially run with DSC Off. I dont think the difference in throttle response in that environment will outweigh the likelihood that DTC would be kicking in at times.

We shall see.

Seemed like a good place to go hoon this car. I typically track a sorted e36 m3. Prior to that, an e30. The f22 is the daily driver, but I wanted to go push it a little, but not at the track, as I prefer having the security that the cage/seats/harness, etc give in my e36.
for auto-x you can run DSC OFF ... you won't be going fast enough for anything bad to happen...

at a road course I would run sport+ unless you have enough experience and know what you are doing, but you can always turn DSC OFF and push incrementally
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