[Broken1]

A while ago, I posted about my clutch slipping, or having a shuddering sensation on it.

Well, seems the problem is a bit of a gremlin. Sometimes it would be there, sometimes not. Mostly it would happen in the mornings, when leaving for varsity. BUT it would not happen every morning.

I've nailed it down slightly. I believe the shuddering clutch problem only happen when the car is cold. Since the weather has been a little chilly here it's been a bit more "noticable"

Today, the car shuddered REALLY badly, at one stop. But then didn't do it again.

It varies in "intensity" from a small vibration on the clutch pedal to a full on, entire car shuddering shake.

It only happens when the car is cold, in 1st gear, just as the clutch engages.

Does anyone know what it is? I have a service in 4000km's (+-2 months) so I don't want to take the car in unnessacerily. Also, the problem is when I do take the car in - the car is warm already - and they won't be able to diagnose the problem.

[rebelfocus]

I have slight shuddering on the clutch when the car is cold in 1st gear. It only lasts a couple of minutes and like you it doesn't happen every day.

My car is still very new so I put it down to clutch wear-in and I think it has got a bit better in the last few weeks (I'm at 3000kms now)

I heard before that BMWs tend to give the driver quite a lot of "clutch feel" and remember the same thing on a Z3 I had once.

I would interested to hear what you find out about this!

[petesamprs]

I have never experienced any shudder like that, unless I mis-clutched (ie, let it out too quickly). I would take it in ASAP.

[obLu]

I have clutch anomolies first thing in the morning when it's cold ... but I don't park the car outside so it doesn't get ambient temp cold. My problem though isn't with clutch engagement, it's with disengagement. My first 1-2, sometimes 3, clutch disengagements produce clunks or shudders. No matter how slow or fast I push the pedal in, it'll thump. Sometimes very hard, sometimes not so much; it's completely random.

After the car warms up, never does it again.

Been thinking of having it looked at, but I doubt they'll produce anything of note. Mechanices like things to be broken so they don't have to diagnose anything.

[Broken1]

Originally Posted by obLu

I have clutch anomolies first thing in the morning when it's cold ... but I don't park the car outside so it doesn't get ambient temp cold. My problem though isn't with clutch engagement, it's with disengagement. My first 1-2, sometimes 3, clutch disengagements produce clunks or shudders. No matter how slow or fast I push the pedal in, it'll thump. Sometimes very hard, sometimes not so much; it's completely random.

After the car warms up, never does it again.

Been thinking of having it looked at, but I doubt they'll produce anything of note. Mechanices like things to be broken so they don't have to diagnose anything.

Just to confirm : I consider "engaging" to be releasing the clutch and moving off the line (pulling off)

[Scarabeo]

Just thinking out of the box here...could the the cold weather be affecting the CDV?

[E90Fleet]

Originally Posted by Scarabeo

Just thinking out of the box here...could the the cold weather be affecting the CDV?

Its summer here where broken1 lives

[thrill30]

Originally Posted by obLu

I have clutch anomolies first thing in the morning when it's cold ... but I don't park the car outside so it doesn't get ambient temp cold. My problem though isn't with clutch engagement, it's with disengagement. My first 1-2, sometimes 3, clutch disengagements produce clunks or shudders. No matter how slow or fast I push the pedal in, it'll thump. Sometimes very hard, sometimes not so much; it's completely random.

After the car warms up, never does it again.

Been thinking of having it looked at, but I doubt they'll produce anything of note. Mechanices like things to be broken so they don't have to diagnose anything.

I have exactly the same problem as you described... it happens when I depress the clutch to engage a gear... it happens randomly, and only in stop-go traffic in the morning, when the engine is still fairly cold, but if I depress the clutch "very fast" to engage a gear, this never happens.... weird .

I have not noticed this when the car has been warmed up properly...... well, I'm not too worried about it because I can control it whenever it happens.

[rebelfocus]

I only experience this...

- first thing in the morning (the 1st time I use the car after it has been sitting there for a 12 hrs +)
- it is quite cold here at the moment (<5 degrees) so that might be a factor
- doesn't happen every morning, maybe 1 in 10
- isn't particularly worse when it is especially cold
- only happens from stop to moving off in 1st
- goes away after a minute or two as the car warms up
- the sensation is like that of the wheels slipping on a slippery surface (slight shudder felt in the car, you can really feel in through the pedal)
- seems to be getting slightly better as the car runs in (I think)

I wonder if this is more common on a diesel engine with all that low-down torque?

[Bimmerista]

Sheesh. I have not experienced this (non diesel in a garage)

[porscheneer]

Originally Posted by Broken1

A while ago, I posted about my clutch slipping, or having a shuddering sensation on it.

Well, seems the problem is a bit of a gremlin. Sometimes it would be there, sometimes not. Mostly it would happen in the mornings, when leaving for varsity. BUT it would not happen every morning.

I've nailed it down slightly. I believe the shuddering clutch problem only happen when the car is cold. Since the weather has been a little chilly here it's been a bit more "noticable"

Today, the car shuddered REALLY badly, at one stop. But then didn't do it again.

It varies in "intensity" from a small vibration on the clutch pedal to a full on, entire car shuddering shake.

It only happens when the car is cold, in 1st gear, just as the clutch engages.

Does anyone know what it is? I have a service in 4000km's (+-2 months) so I don't want to take the car in unnessacerily. Also, the problem is when I do take the car in - the car is warm already - and they won't be able to diagnose the problem.

I’m not sure how relevant my experience is because it was not an E90 that I experienced the shudder.

There was almost always some slight clutch shudder in the morning with the 996 clutch, especially if you like to drag race launch your car every now and then. In this case, the lining has been severely overheated and looses some of its cold grip properties. Once it is heated up to operating temp it takes off smoothly again.

Even the standard, normally driven car may on occasion shudder a bit in the mornings. The real problem is not the clutch, but the fact that there are five drive shafts that can easily 'ring'. A cold clutch, especially one with materials that last a long time, are going to have a different slip property when stone cold and a tendency to shudder. This is way passenger cars have soft engine mounts and release valves in the clutch master cylinder. I’m not exactly sure how the E90 is set up I have the step.

If you have clutch shudder in the mornings, try using less gas and less slip to get the car underway slowly in the neighborhood. Usually four or five stop signs will get enough heat in the disk that the shudder goes away. I could make mine shudder or not depending on if I remembered to take it easy first few standing starts.

[RPM90]

Originally Posted by Broken1

A while ago, I posted about my clutch slipping, or having a shuddering sensation on it.

Well, seems the problem is a bit of a gremlin. Sometimes it would be there, sometimes not. Mostly it would happen in the mornings, when leaving for varsity. BUT it would not happen every morning.

I've nailed it down slightly. I believe the shuddering clutch problem only happen when the car is cold. Since the weather has been a little chilly here it's been a bit more "noticable"

Today, the car shuddered REALLY badly, at one stop. But then didn't do it again.

It varies in "intensity" from a small vibration on the clutch pedal to a full on, entire car shuddering shake.

It only happens when the car is cold, in 1st gear, just as the clutch engages.

Does anyone know what it is? I have a service in 4000km's (+-2 months) so I don't want to take the car in unnessacerily. Also, the problem is when I do take the car in - the car is warm already - and they won't be able to diagnose the problem.

Really? Interesting that a lot of people are getting it.

So, I have and have had this "problem" with my 325i, and I've had it on another manual car. It could be something as simple as a glazed clutch. This can happen if you give a bit much throttle and are really slow with the clutch release. It's like getting brake glaze on your rotors and then you feel a shudder in the brakes on high speed braking. So, you may have clutch material on the flywheel and/or some glazed clutch material on the clutch itself.
Oddly, this does seem to be more pronounced in the morning.
That could be related to the clutch fluid being colder and more viscous until it warms up, so by being thicker it slows the action of the clutch thus making the shudder more pronounced.

Ever since manufacturers started using clutch delay valves to help smooth out the shift, it seems more people complain about shudder issues. That valve goes in line with the clutch fluid to help slow down the fluids action to help smooth out the clutch engagement.
The problem is that a good manual driver will do smooth clutch engagement on his/her own, but with that valve in place the clutch engagment is even slower thus delaying the full mating of clutch to flywheel and causing excessive heat build up and then a glazed clutch and some shuddering.

Of course, this also happens on aggressive take off. If you are giving a big push on the loud pedal, yet you don't let out the clutch quickly, there is a longer than expected delay and with that much throttle the heat process is even more intense and glazing can happen as easily as it does on a crispy creme donut.

There is an old school technique that can help deglaze if that is the issue. Do some 2nd gear starts with low throttle, but do it smoothly and don't use too much delay. The point is to try and get some quick friction between the 2 materials to help clean off the glaze.
You can also try some 1st takeoffs, but you have to do it with very quick clutch release so that it snaps and clamps quickly cause you don't need any more glaze Mr. donut.

Oh, and try not to ride the clutch in traffic, that always hurts us manual guys.

T

[Scarabeo]

Try removing or modifying the CDV valve and see if that cures the problem - fortunately I have not had any problems yet and I have over 19,000 miles on my 325i.....

[SRT]

Are you sure that your not revving enough to make the car move off? When you get used to a manual you get the tendency to rev less and less as time goes on, and get the shuddering sensation as the back wheels (standing still) try to slow down the flywheel as you bring the clutch up because there wasn't enough torque (rev build up)

[Broken1]

Originally Posted by RR

Are you sure that your not revving enough to make the car move off? When you get used to a manual you get the tendency to rev less and less as time goes on, and get the shuddering sensation as the back wheels (standing still) try to slow down the flywheel as you bring the clutch up because there wasn't enough torque (rev build up)

Yea. When I first noticed the problem, I thought it was my driving style. But other poeple have noticed it, even on my car, and it ONLY happens in the mornings....

It's not a serious problem, as it's only happens in the morning when the car is cold, and not even every morning. I just wanted to be sure there isn't anything majorly wrong - which would require immediate attention.

I will mention it at my service, but it seems most poeple agree it's not serious - and I shouldn't worry too much about it!

[Tierfreund]

Count me in.
I have the same phenomenon. Only on cold mornings, only occasionally, not really a big problem. Only a sligth shudder.
It´s not diesel specific, I guess, mine is gasoline.

[ben1364]

I suggest that you take the car in right away, before accumulating many more miles. I had a premature clutch failure on one E 30 car and clutch was replaced under warranty. I would want the symptoms to be noted on a service order in case it gets worse.

[basti313]

BMW solved this problem in December 2006. Since then new cars get the new clutch and flywheel version (check Realoem for that).
If you have a problem with your clutch when its cold (shuddering) you can go to your dealer and have clutch and flywheel changed.
In Germany the new parts are not available at the moment...too high demand.
I'm also waiting till my new clutch arrives at my dealer.

[timmerweb]

Originally Posted by basti313

BMW solved this problem in December 2006. Since then new cars get the new clutch and flywheel version (check Realoem for that).
If you have a problem with your clutch when its cold (shuddering) you can go to your dealer and have clutch and flywheel changed.
In Germany the new parts are not available at the moment...too high demand.
I'm also waiting till my new clutch arrives at my dealer.

Is there a TSB about this issue? It sounds a bit what I get... just some slightly rough clutch engagement in the morning. I can't say if its only cold mornings or not, since every morning here has been cold for the last few months.


-Tim

[STE92VE]

Originally Posted by Broken1

Also, the problem is when I do take the car in - the car is warm already - and they won't be able to diagnose the problem.

Drop your car off the nite before your scheduled service. This way when they get to it in the morning, it will be cold and they can duplicate the problem. If they give you a loaner, try to be there in the morning so you can demonstrate exactly what you are feeling.

[topracer]

I recently have the same problem. March 07 production E90 335i, everything stock. Temperature was below 70 degrees in the morning. The clutch pedal vibrates while engaging the 1st gear for the first few miles.

Did anyone have that fixed by the dealer?

[giem]

had my clutch, flywheel all replaced at dealer, no charge