[Helio324]

anybody have experience and dyno numbers for running port injection with just the fuel-it stage 2 LPFP?

Should've went with stage 3 from the start but i never thought I'd upgrade twins and now wishing I had. My goal is 650whp on e50 tune at roughly 25psi, definitely not looking 700+ or to break any records.

[madmantwo]

MMP website says his turbos can hit ~650whp with stage 2 LPFP and e50, I'm assuming PI is also used there

[Helio324]

Originally Posted by madmantwo

MMP website says his turbos can hit ~650whp with stage 2 LPFP and e50, I'm assuming PI is also used there

Sorry to say but that's the wrong assumption. I clarified that with him. Those #'s you quoted are with stage 2 lpfp only, no additional fueling via TBI or PI.

And by the way, I have his MMP stage 3 with just stage 2 LPFP with e50 tune at 22.5 PSI and cant get those dyno number's he's claiming, by far. Turbos are fine, it's fueling thats the limiting factor.

Quite disappointed. Hence I'm here now hoping people would chime in on their S2 and PI.

[TEC]

Ugh, i hate the whole stages BS. It's like being on a Honda forum again. Wtf is a stage two lpfp?

Anyway one walbro flows enough for 500 whp under the right conditions. Two running together should get you there plus some.

[rosullivan04]

I can't say I've ran across anyone with PI and stage 2 personally. Have you asked Steve if he knows of anybody? What numbers are you pulling with your current setup?

[jlcf22]

I think frankenturbos hit around 640whp with stage 2 and tbi with e50

[Helio324]

Originally Posted by rosullivan04

I can't say I've ran across anyone with PI and stage 2 personally. Have you asked Steve if he knows of anybody? What numbers are you pulling with your current setup?

I haven't asked steve about this, kinda wanted real life results from people and not theoretical max performance numbers.

I bought the MMP S3 with just stage 2 LPFP in hoping to make 630whp since that was what is advertised on the website. I dyno'd at 532whp on e50 at 22.5 PSI so as you can see I'm way below goal so quite disappointed.

At time of install I had new plugs, coils. Log showed no timing pull so octane was great. LPFP was averaging around 65-75 psi. HPFP around 1200-1400 psi, and once in a while would dip to 1050. Misfire would occur at top of 4th on back to back pulls. At time of dyno I think I had e60 since I wanted to make sure octane wasn't going to ruin the runs, which equates to 2 extra gallon of e85 in the 16 gallon tank, but considering S2 LPFP can run 100% E85 i dont think that was a factor.

[Ozzie335i]

Helio, I have to ask, is 532 whp not enough? The car should be a monster at that power level.

[turekaj]

532 hp is not "monster" power to some of us. Especially us who are used to 500 whp in a fwd 2800 lb rocket

[DennisPacMo]

Originally Posted by jlcf22

I think frankenturbos hit around 640whp with stage 2 and tbi with e50

Yes but that is not a good long term solution. Ken (Wedge) and Doug (Frankenturbo) both note that these numbers were with a lack of adequate fueling.

[mj6234]

Seems like there is no way to get >550whp with any meaningful mix of ethanol without HPFP crashing. From what you are saying, the LPFP probably isnt the limitation. 1000psi on the HPFP sounds more like the problem. Adding PI reduces strain on the HPFP by not requiring DI to work as hard.

If you read Steve@FuelIt's posts around, there is no way people are making that power without PI. Maybe on 100+ unleaded gas.

Since this site blocks linking to other relevant forums, here is the snippet.

Q: I'd like to run ethanol (E85) what upgrades do I need?

To run moderate to high concentrations of ethanol you'll need a Stage 2 or Stage 3 LPFP depending on your power goals.
Stage 2 will be needed for up to approx. 550whp and Stage 3 will be needed for 550whp+
A healthy stock HPFP on an E-Series can support up to approx. 430whp on E85 and approx. 460whp on E50ish.

[cortez08]

Originally Posted by Helio324

I haven't asked steve about this, kinda wanted real life results from people and not theoretical max performance numbers.

I bought the MMP S3 with just stage 2 LPFP in hoping to make 630whp since that was what is advertised on the website. I dyno'd at 532whp on e50 at 22.5 PSI so as you can see I'm way below goal so quite disappointed.

At time of install I had new plugs, coils. Log showed no timing pull so octane was great. LPFP was averaging around 65-75 psi. HPFP around 1200-1400 psi, and once in a while would dip to 1050. Misfire would occur at top of 4th on back to back pulls. At time of dyno I think I had e60 since I wanted to make sure octane wasn't going to ruin the runs, which equates to 2 extra gallon of e85 in the 16 gallon tank, but considering S2 LPFP can run 100% E85 i dont think that was a factor.

I have read through his site many times and never remember the claim of 630WHP on on LPFP upgrade only on E50. I thought it was 100oct on meth that got that number but maybe I missed it. Either way it is very well known that secondary fueling is needed over 525 WHP on E50 on the N54. At least until the injector spray window time is increased via tuning.

[Ozzie335i]

Originally Posted by turekaj

532 hp is not "monster" power to some of us. Especially us who are used to 500 whp in a fwd 2800 lb rocket

Knock yourself out with your S2000 or EVO.

[cortez08]

Originally Posted by cortez08

I have read through his site many times and never remember the claim of 630WHP on on LPFP upgrade only on E50. I thought it was 100oct on meth that got that number but maybe I missed it. Either way it is very well known that secondary fueling is needed over 525 WHP on E50 on the N54. At least until the injector spray window time is increased via tuning.

I checked it out and I stand corrected it does say that. I don't see how that is possible. Maybe he forgot to mention the meth?

[Helio324]

Originally Posted by cortez08

I checked it out and I stand corrected it does say that. I don't see how that is possible. Maybe he forgot to mention the meth?

It's actually more today than what it originally advertised 2 months ago, 600-615whp with only stage 3 lpfp. As of today that advertised number has gone up to 650whp. I called him directly prior to buying it to make sure he didn't overlook TBI or meth but he said explicitly it's just with stage 2 pump. Needless to say that's above my 600 goal and I was ecstatic, even though I knew from steve that 550 was more likely.

My tuner and I dont understand how he can get such a high #. 2-3 other people with my exact same setup are getting 510-535 so I'm not the only one with this result.

And theres definitely 2-3 people who were first adopters of pure stage 2 that had just stage 2 lpfp and 100% meth making 680-700whp, dyno verified. Their engines finally blew at some point. There's absolute no way I'm running meth, and to be honest due to safety mechanisms not fully mapped out for PI directly from the DME, I'm kinda hesitant to run PI also.

[mj6234]

Originally Posted by Helio324

It's actually more today than what it originally advertised 2 months ago, 600-615whp with only stage 3 lpfp. As of today that advertised number has gone up to 650whp. I called him directly prior to buying it to make sure he didn't overlook TBI or meth but he said explicitly it's just with stage 2 pump. Needless to say that's above my 600 goal and I was ecstatic, even though I knew from steve that 550 was more likely.

My tuner and I dont understand how he can get such a high #. 2-3 other people with my exact same setup are getting 510-535 so I'm not the only one with this result.

And theres definitely 2-3 people who were first adopters of pure stage 2 that had just stage 2 lpfp and 100% meth making 680-700whp, dyno verified. Their engines finally blew at some point. There's absolute no way I'm running meth, and to be honest due to safety mechanisms not fully mapped out for PI directly from the DME, I'm kinda hesitant to run PI also.

I don't believe 630whp with just a LPFP upgrade (unless non-ethanol race fuel). I have GC lites and trims are starting to be an issue at E30 and 21psi in the mid range. I think I could run maybe 23psi up top, but has been difficult to do anything since something seems to break weekly that I have to stop and address. That seems to be similar to where you are getting before supplemental fueling is needed.

[turekaj]

Originally Posted by Ozzie335i

Knock yourself out with your S2000 or EVO.

Actually it was a Cobalt SS. I said FWD

[Milan]

I was able to do 100% E85 on my old single turbo car, 6466 on 20 psi. The LPFP pressure was dipping a little bit but the HPFP was holding strong and so were AFR so no problems there. Car rolled out. Our E85 here is like E90 too.

[Ozzie335i]

Originally Posted by turekaj

Actually it was a Cobalt SS. I said FWD

Ah yes, the mini GTR. Or is the GTR the Cobalt's big brother. Regardless, anything over 500 whp is darn fast.

[07tundra]

Well pretty old thread but I have a friend running a stage2 (not fuelit) at 26psi with PI and no issue also a good concentration of e85. Vs some elses stage2 and only being able to run 21psi on ST 6262. I would say at 26psi he's definitely in the low 600s

[d8rknight]

Originally Posted by Helio324

Sorry to say but that's the wrong assumption. I clarified that with him. Those #'s you quoted are with stage 2 lpfp only, no additional fueling via TBI or PI.

And by the way, I have his MMP stage 3 with just stage 2 LPFP with e50 tune at 22.5 PSI and cant get those dyno number's he's claiming, by far. Turbos are fine, it's fueling thats the limiting factor.

Quite disappointed. Hence I'm here now hoping people would chime in on their S2 and PI.

glad im not the only one. Gonna just bite the bullet and do it correctly with PI and stage 3 lpfp. I rather measure x2 and cut once. I dont need 650+ power as my goals were similar to yours. But its all about if u want to hit those numbers safely.

[d8rknight]

granted you're now out an additional $1400 in parts... not ot mention you prob need a better FMIC. but once its done... its done. Enjoy a 93 tune and save up for the rest.