[Erc5008]

Is the first oil change really at 10K miles? The owners manual talks about a break-in period of 1200 mi. but I'm surprised an oil change is not recommended at this period as well. Does anyone know of anything different that this?

[floydarogers]

Originally Posted by Erc5008

Is the first oil change really at 10K miles? The owners manual talks about a break-in period of 1200 mi. but I'm surprised an oil change is not recommended at this period as well. Does anyone know of anything different that this?

Change it if you like, but it's really 10K (or whatever CBS comes up with.)
No change is needed; it's not an M-engine, which do have a change then.
Speculation is that a) they use a special factory fill and you will lose it's benefits, b) even for non-special, it's been pretty well established that changing synthetic oil too often (less than 2500 miles?) causes MORE wear than running more extended intervals.

This has been well covered in various threads over the years; you might search in the engine forums, and over on E90POST.

[adhrp]

Everyone gets an oil change at the CBS recommended time (10-15k miles usually, sometimes more), unless your are one who prefers to do their own oil changes at self-defined times. BMW will not cover an oil change at 1200 miles.

Search on this topic on any forum and you will find a dozen threads...please search.

[snowghost]

Originally Posted by floydarogers

Change it if you like, but it's really 10K (or whatever CBS comes up with.)
No change is needed; it's not an M-engine, which do have a change then.
Speculation is that a) they use a special factory fill and you will lose it's benefits, b) even for non-special, it's been pretty well established that changing synthetic oil too often (less than 2500 miles?) causes MORE wear than running more extended intervals.

This has been well covered in various threads over the years; you might search in the engine forums, and over on E90POST.

Yes only the ///M engines require change after break-in. I did my first at 10k, and am not at all worried.

[RedlinePSI]

Well I'm gonna play the other side of the coin here just to make sure this is not an easy decision for you. I would definitely not wait 10K miles to do an oil change, especially the first one. If you really care about the car I would do one myself at 5K if I were you. I do one about every 5K, whether BMW does it or I do it.

[snowghost]

Originally Posted by RedlinePSI

Well I'm gonna play the other side of the coin here just to make sure this is not an easy decision for you. I would definitely not wait 10K miles to do an oil change, especially the first one. If you really care about the car I would do one myself at 5K if I were you. I do one about every 5K, whether BMW does it or I do it.

My buddy has a 1998 Z3 with well over 100k miles on it and he does 15k mile oil changes. Car runs like a top.

[Soothsayr]

Originally Posted by snowghost

My buddy has a 1998 Z3 with well over 100k miles on it and he does 15k mile oil changes. Car runs like a top.

I agree. My E90 went 160k miles with no issues with oil changes at 15k miles.

Really, oil changes should take in your driving habits in consideration. If you're an average driver, I wouldn't worry about the 10-15k thing.

[RedlinePSI]

Originally Posted by snowghost

My buddy has a 1998 Z3 with well over 100k miles on it and he does 15k mile oil changes. Car runs like a top.

That is just the thing though, I go by experience as well. I did 3-5K synthetic oil changes on my 2 previous cars and they both ran like they did in the showroom the day I sold them. Absolute silk compared to other people with the same cars. You could tell the difference from 50 feet away. The former was just about to hit 100K miles when I sold it.

Every car is different, so it's all a gamble, but there are also cases where peoples cars run like shit who don't do the changes that much. Once a year (more or less) just does not sit well with me. Why take the chance, do oil changes often.

[snowghost]

Originally Posted by RedlinePSI

That is just the thing though, I go by experience as well. I did 3-5K synthetic oil changes on my 2 previous cars and they both ran like they did in the showroom the day I sold them. Absolute silk compared to other people with the same cars. You could tell the difference from 50 feet away. The former was just about to hit 100K miles when I sold it.

Every car is different, so it's all a gamble, but there are also cases where peoples cars run like shit who don't do the changes that much. Once a year (more or less) just does not sit well with me. Why take the chance, do oil changes often.

I was on your side of the fence for many years until I saw studies that do show better lubrication if you leave the oil in longer.

[Agamemnon]

I am an old timer that grew up with the idea of changing oil every three months. However, with modern synthetic oils I realize that the old thinking had to go. These oils easily go a year and/or 10k. It really is a waste of money and resources changing the oil early. For low mileage BMW, the dealer will change the oil annually as part of the free service.

I am also aware that the dealer will do a free top up of oil in between if you are burning oil. I think I can add a half later oil here and there out of my own pocket - about the price of the fuel running to the dealer. Mine doesn't burn much oil - about half a litre in 10,000 kilometres. The engine was carefully run in per the manufacturer's recommendations.

[RedlinePSI]

Originally Posted by snowghost

I was on your side of the fence for many years until I saw studies that do show better lubrication if you leave the oil in longer.

Yes, i've seen similar work ups where oil that was in there approaching 10K or whatever was still safe. I'm just being old school stubborn. But I still believe it can only help to change it every 5K. It's not like the oil is coming out clear. I know it does not mean everything, but it's pitch black at 5K so it is at least quite a ways along in filling up with contaminants. I also bought all these cars, and I enjoy hanging out in the garage. Mostly when it's warm out.

But throughout the industry, the change intervals usually range from 5-10 thousand. A few use 15K. Hey, i've advanced from 3 thousand mile changes to 5. I'm giving in a bit. I think 5K, or about 2 a year for a typical car, is a good middle ground. That is not going to break the bank and keeps you ahead of the game.

By the way, how exactly do they measure "lubrication"? I know they can test for contamination in ppm for oil. Measuring actual lubrication sounds entirely different, and I have no idea how they would do that without getting very sophisticated.

[visor]

Been covered many times before.

Synthetic oil will last that long,
but the problem is the oil filter will not.

[AppStoreMoney]

Back when I bought my car, it was every 15K miles. BMW probably realized it wasn't frequent enough, and they changed it to every 10K miles.

I always tell them to change my oil at the half way point, without reseting the counter. With the exception of one time, they always just did this for me for free.

[Vitoco]

Originally Posted by AppStoreMoney

Back when I bought my car, it was every 15K miles. BMW probably realized it wasn't frequent enough, and they changed it to every 10K miles.

I always tell them to change my oil at the half way point, without reseting the counter. With the exception of one time, they always just did this for me for free.

This. And I had them change the oil right after break-in as well. But I payed for the extra oil and filter.

[335BOY]

Go to AUDIZINE (B8 S4)and search. There are guys there that have their oil tested between changes. Absolute waste of time and money before 7000 I believe it said.
An engine runs noticeably smoother from 50 ft because oil was changed more often? That doesnt make any sense. Old oil won't affect smoothness. Ignition and fuel but not oil.

[KneeDragr]

Some experts say if you go a full year it might make sense to change early, thats what I do in my cars. One calender year or factory interval whichever is earlier.

[zamboni]

I will bring mine in at 5K for oil change since it's only cost $90 for the service, the 2014 models and up BMW recommended oil change at 10K instead of 15K.

[HighlandPete]

Over this side of the pond we are running CBS intervals up to about 20K miles or 2-years, which ever comes sooner. And doing this with diesel engines as well.

Not saying it is good, but do agree that the filter is the likely weak link, rather than the fully synthetic oils we are now using.

Plus our oil is not as cheap it appears, as in the US. Many BMW models are under fleet control, so running costs over 3 or 4-years is the driver.

I'm surprised anyone really sees the need to change at less than 10k miles, with a fully synthetic oil, we've been at that service level for years in the UK, (15-years or more) across many marques.

HighlandPete

[floydarogers]

Originally Posted by RedlinePSI

... But I still believe it can only help to change it every 5K. It's not like the oil is coming out clear. I know it does not mean everything, but it's pitch black at 5K so it is at least quite a ways along in filling up with contaminants...

So, when you change oil in one of the diesels, the new oil immediately becomes black. Are you saying that we need to change it again and again until it stays clear?

It's pretty clear from a thread about oil changes on the diesel subforum on bimmerfest (and similar postings on e90post) where several of us reported on Blackstone Labs analyses that the factory 13K intervals (different from gas) were doable. However, to leave some margin I and others do them at 10K. 5K is a waste. 7.5K is a waste.

You should do your own testing and convince yourself of this.

[snowghost]

Originally Posted by HighlandPete

Over this side of the pond we are running CBS intervals up to about 20K miles or 2-years, which ever comes sooner. And doing this with diesel engines as well.

Not saying it is good, but do agree that the filter is the likely weak link, rather than the fully synthetic oils we are now using.

Plus our oil is not as cheap it appears, as in the US. Many BMW models are under fleet control, so running costs over 3 or 4-years is the driver.

I'm surprised anyone really sees the need to change at less than 10k miles, with a fully synthetic oil, we've been at that service level for years in the UK, (15-years or more) across many marques.

HighlandPete

+1

I never let it go to 15k in the old days, but did 7.5k intervals. But with new data about synthetic, I'm comfortable with 10k or once a year.

[RedlinePSI]

Originally Posted by 335BOY

Go to AUDIZINE (B8 S4)and search. There are guys there that have their oil tested between changes. Absolute waste of time and money before 7000 I believe it said.
An engine runs noticeably smoother from 50 ft because oil was changed more often? That doesnt make any sense. Old oil won't affect smoothness. Ignition and fuel but not oil.

Seriously, rethink that! Oil quality can't affect how smooth an engine runs over time? oook

[RedlinePSI]

Originally Posted by floydarogers

So, when you change oil in one of the diesels, the new oil immediately becomes black. Are you saying that we need to change it again and again until it stays clear?

It's pretty clear from a thread about oil changes on the diesel subforum on bimmerfest (and similar postings on e90post) where several of us reported on Blackstone Labs analyses that the factory 13K intervals (different from gas) were doable. However, to leave some margin I and others do them at 10K. 5K is a waste. 7.5K is a waste.

You should do your own testing and convince yourself of this.

Ha, um I think your a little quick on the trigger there to feed your appetite to correct somebody. Try reading closer and I clearly said that I know it does not mean everything, BUT... And if you're such the oil genius you know that the more contaminants it picks up the darker it gets. So YES, when oil looks like fkin tar I would say it's already latched onto quite a bit of material. Do you think that can just go on forever? My opinion is if oil is already pitch black, I definitely don't want to go another 5-10 thousand miles on that oil. My point was that even if technically safe for a little while longer, it was obviously far from in great condition, so how can it be bad to change it at this point!

God you people take this shit so personally.

BTW you do realize that diesel engine do run dirtier on the inside and generally require more frequent oil changes right? Good comparison though.