Detailed M4 HPDE track day review - Update - June 13/15

[gthal]

     Featured on BIMMERPOST.com

Today I finally got the M4 out for a HPDE day. Pretty full day with a lot of neat cars. I was running solo in the advanced group with a 911S, a 911 Turbo, a Corvette ZR1, a Z06, a Grand Sport, a Porsche 944 dedicated track car, an Audi R8 (V8) and an Audi R8 that was heavily modified and pushing 1100HP

We were running 20 minute lapping sessions and I ended up getting 4 in before needing to leave for a business trip.

My set up...

• My M4 was stock other than Castrol SRF fluid and Carbotech XP12/10 pads
• I set cold tire pressure to 28psi and it worked well
• Started off trying MDM but ended up with DSC off
• I found sport mode for all settings to give the best result

Overall, I was very happy with the car's performance. Turn in was very good and the car felt very balanced to me. It was predictable, stable and I always new exactly what the car was doing. I did not notice any turbo lag at all and I suspect no one would when the car is always in higher RPM levels and the turbos are spooled up. It felt very naturally aspirated to me.

The car felt very composed on mid corner bumps and when the pavement was uneven in braking zones. Speaking of brakes, they were fantastic with the Carbotech XP12/10 pads. Zero fade and very consistent braking. It took me 35 minutes (I timed myself ) to swap the track pads in last night and I have to say I'm impressed with the stopping power of the car.

The car never moved, temp wise, outside of the exact same engine temps as I see in street driving. The DCT was flawless. My only complaint there is that I couldn't hear the car downshift as the downshift is pretty quiet in the F8X vs. the E9X. I drive a lot by sound and feel and it took a bit to get use to that. The seats in the car were very good and much better than the E92 in holding me in place.

There is one Achilles heel, IMO. The tires. I found they got fairly greasy after 10-15 minutes on the track. Also, and maybe more importantly, it was VERY tough getting the power down coming out of tight corners. One corner, in particular, is a downhill approach to a tight 180 degree corner to go back up hill. All the car wanted to do was spin the rear wheels regardless as how smooth I was with the throttle. This car NEEDS a set of 325 tires with more grip. Period. For those who have been debating that the PSS on the C7 Stingray are the same as on the M4, I can tell you based on my experience today that they are not. The PSS compound Michelin developed for the C7 did not get greasy and had better grip. The PSS on the M4 did not perform as well. If I had a set of AD-08, RE-11 or an R888 in a 305+ rear, the car would have been an absolute monster. I am definitely swapping the tires out and dialing in more camber.

What surprised me was how many people complimented the sound of the car. Apparently, it sounds fantastic to those sitting in the paddock as I drove by on the front straight

So, how does it compare to my previous cars?

E92 M3... the M4 was faster, better balanced, better turn-in and ultimate grip, better braking. It felt more stable and I found it more predictable. It instilled more confidence.

C63... similar comments to the E92 M3 above. In many ways, the M4 was like a C63 and E92 M3 combined. The power/torque of the C63 with the balance, chassis, weight and handling advantages of the E92 M3.

C7 Z51... the Corvette is simply a better track car. It puts the power down much better, is even easier to drive at the limit (although the M4 is very easy IMO) and I can carry higher speeds almost everywhere on the track. I was about 3-4 mph slower at the end of the back straight in the M4. This is not a bad thing for the M4... it is a great track car... but the C7 Z51 is just a better overall track car. I ran neck and neck with the 911S (similar driver skill) but the 911S and the 911 Turbo couldn't keep up with me in the C7 at the last track day. I was consistently passing both cars with the C7 but running very similar laps as those cars in the M4.

So, overall a very fun and very enjoyable day. The car is very fast, very easy to trust and very consistent. With better tires, I would bet I'm running the same pace as the Z51 C7. I'm happy and very impressed.

Some iPhone pics...

P.S. The blue E36 M3 in some of the pictures was my one of my previous track cars. It is now being raced. What a great track car that was.

P.P.S. The Jag was an impressive car... beautiful inside and out and sound amazing.

[Mortis]

Excellent review - many thanks!

[FTS]

Such a positive review, thank you for the details and photos. I am truly glad to hear the car felt balanced and certainly about the brakes. I would suspect once you feel a little more at home with the new car and maybe more tires, you will gain back some of the lost pace from the C7.

[dkhm3]

amazing- good to know the m did not overheat.

[Mandi90TT]

Originally Posted by gthal

The car never moved, temp wise, outside of the exact same engine temps as I see in street driving.

That is really good to hear. Always a big concern, especially with a turbo car, how it will handle temperature when pushed hard.

As for the tires, when I tracked my previous car, I quickly switched to using r-comp tires on a set of wheels I had, not for the extra grip, but because I quickly got sick of ruining a good set of street tires too quickly from track wear.

[rubber_ducky]

Since you weren't sure when the car was downshifting, I assume you ran with the tranny in auto mode. Needless to say, taking control of the shifting will remedy that.

The main reason I went from a pdk back to a 6mt is that I found myself putting the pdk in auto mode at the track. Eventually, I stopped caring about what gear I was in because it really didn't matter. Which I wasnt proud of.

Otherwise... good news all around. Excellent post

[karussell]

M4 just needs way more tire. I think 295's if they fit on the rear. up to 275's in front. mpss's get greasy if they are over inflated. what hot pressure were you using? i experimented with the M4 on SPA and Ring and found they prefer lower pressures than the e90 on the track.

[Damasconian]

Great review from someone who has great insight into these various cars.

Still want to know why you traded in the C7?

[Lynchmob6]

Excellent write-up...thanks for posting.

[M3 Esq]

Nice review. Not surprising to hear the tires were greasy. PSS don't have a great reputation as a track tire. You'll do a lot better with a more track focused tire or r-comp. The trick is to find out how to dial in more negative camber up front.

Is that a Porsche 917? Sick! Was someone driving that on track?

[rubber_ducky]

I may have missed this data point, but what track did all of this go down at?

[Brosef]

awesome review. thanks for posting

[Black Gold]

Thanks so much for the review, I can't wait to get this car on track

I'm waiting for some hre / morr wheels to be released in 9.5/10.5 widths so we can properly run ad08r or re11 in 275/295 widths

[MaynardZed]

Thanks for the review. I had many of the same impressions when I took mine out for its first track day. Did you say you liked it best with DSC and MDM off, or with DSC off and MDM on? I haven't figured out the best settings yet. I'll have my F82 out again in a couple of weeks. Carbotechs are on their way.

Totally agree on the tire. Next time get you some of these!



295/30/19 Toyo R888. They bulge just a tad but fit fine on the stock rims. Agree waiting on better wheel offsets and 9.5/10.5 wheels or better yet 10/11.

Car also desperately needs camber plates. Anyone have any info on these yet?

[karussell]

all i see in these photos 917!!! 917!!! 917!!!

looks like a fun day!

[W///]

Thanks for the feedback, very well written.

That E36 looks like a hoot to drive. I can't wait to take mine to the track, I feel like I could explore its limits way more than my E92 (I'm a novice). I know it's apples to watermelons, but care to compare the F82 to your E36?

[karussell]

i can weigh in on that having owned and raced e36 m3's. for someone new to the sport i think the e36 is much better. its far cheaper, safer aka lower speed, perfectly nimble, low weight so it doesn't eat up consumables. there is always a risk of balling up a car on a track. if you have a new expensive one its always on your mind so you tend to hold back. the less this effect is felt the better and you can focus on more important matters. still with proper self control any M3/M4 is fine to learn in. the tricky part is when you are good enough to be dangerous. for that period i switched to an e30 and happily spun it many a times pushing as hard as i could before returning to bigger power. you also learn in an e36 m3 about momentum. it punishes you when you have a crap line whereas you can be anywhere on the track in an F8X and just hit the go pedal to make up for it.

[JoeFromPA]

Originally Posted by M3 Esq

Is that a Porsche 917? Sick! Was someone driving that on track?

I hear their value goes up as you continue tracking them

Reminds me of the Hank Williams Cobra story: http://www.thegentlemanracer.com/201...ams-cobra.html

He still races that thing, and people keep offering him more and more money for it.

[MaynardZed]

I'm sure the 917 was a replica.

[gthal]

Originally Posted by rubber_ducky

Since you weren't sure when the car was downshifting, I assume you ran with the tranny in auto mode. Needless to say, taking control of the shifting will remedy that.

The main reason I went from a pdk back to a 6mt is that I found myself putting the pdk in auto mode at the track. Eventually, I stopped caring about what gear I was in because it really didn't matter. Which I wasnt proud of.

Otherwise... good news all around. Excellent post

Nope... always manual in S2. What I meant was the car is quiet on downshift so I wasn't getting the audible cues I normally listen for.

[nicknaz]

Thanks for sharing OP. Great to hear the engine temps stayed constant and that the M4 is a tire swap away from being similar to the C7

How was the C6 Z06 lapping compared to your M4 and your old C7 Z51 ?

[gthal]

Originally Posted by karussell

M4 just needs way more tire. I think 295's if they fit on the rear. up to 275's in front. mpss's get greasy if they are over inflated. what hot pressure were you using? i experimented with the M4 on SPA and Ring and found they prefer lower pressures than the e90 on the track.

I was running somewhere around 36 hot. The tire was wearing well with a nice amount of rollover to the very edge of the tread. I might go less next time to see.

Originally Posted by Damasconian

Great review from someone who has great insight into these various cars.

Still want to know why you traded in the C7?

Needed a back seat. Loved the C7.

Originally Posted by MaynardZed

Thanks for the review. I had many of the same impressions when I took mine out for its first track day. Did you say you liked it best with DSC and MDM off, or with DSC off and MDM on? I haven't figured out the best settings yet. I'll have my F82 out again in a couple of weeks. Carbotechs are on their way.

Traction completely off... no MDM or DSC.

Originally Posted by W///

Thanks for the feedback, very well written.

That E36 looks like a hoot to drive. I can't wait to take mine to the track, I feel like I could explore its limits way more than my E92 (I'm a novice). I know it's apples to watermelons, but care to compare the F82 to your E36?

My E36 was a dedicated track car... stripped with a full cage, fire system, etc. It was VERY fast on the track and the easiest car I have ever driven. No ABS, no traction control, supremely balanced nonetheless. It was a faster car on tight, short tracks than the F82. Heck, I was faster than Z06's in it at my track (short and technical).

Originally Posted by karussell

i can weigh in on that having owned and raced e36 m3's. for someone new to the sport i think the e36 is much better. its far cheaper, safer aka lower speed, perfectly nimble, low weight so it doesn't eat up consumables. there is always a risk of balling up a car on a track. if you have a new expensive one its always on your mind so you tend to hold back. the less this effect is felt the better and you can focus on more important matters. still with proper self control any M3/M4 is fine to learn in. the tricky part is when you are good enough to be dangerous. for that period i switched to an e30 and happily spun it many a times pushing as hard as i could before returning to bigger power. you also learn in an e36 m3 about momentum. it punishes you when you have a crap line whereas you can be anywhere on the track in an F8X and just hit the go pedal to make up for it.

Completely agree.

Originally Posted by MaynardZed

I'm sure the 917 was a replica.

I believe it was real... and he had it on the track for limited runs. He is a collector. It sure got a lot of attention

EDIT: Did some local research and confirmed it is a replica