[GrumpyBimmerFan]

Hello,

I'm considering leasing the new M5, and would like to up the power a bit, but during my recent visit to BMW with my M2C (which has BM3), the dealer told me that BMW released some kind of software that can detect if ECU was every modified... they said even if I take my tune off and relock ECU, they will be able to see it, and any engine issue/warranty claim on the engine, will be denied They said so far it doesn't seem to be able to detect JB4, but any true tunes will be detected and car will be flagged for life.

sooo yea... are you guys concerned about that? What about those on the lease? Say you don't blow the engine, and return the car from lease, and it used to have a tune, how does the dealer handle that?

[flanast]

Just do a search in the forum. There is already tons of discussion on this subject.

[FatRear08]

Nothing new. They can figure out whatever they want based on how much boost, timing, etc the car was putting out. That being said, tune her, rule the road, and live on the edge. Life is short.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Change your dealer and find one mod-friendly.

They have always had the technology to dig deeper for mods but 99% of dealerships don't care as long as you are not damaging the car

[LongBeachDinanFan]

Well known BMW can detect all flash tuning. Use a JB4 or RaceChip to tide you over, low 10 second potential on the F90 JB4 only anyway!

[spuntyb]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

Change your dealer and find one mod-friendly.

They have always had the technology to dig deeper for mods but 99% of dealerships don't care as long as you are not damaging the car

+1

Find the right dealer, and get to know them. I've piggyback tuned all my Bimmers and never been asked about it, and never been denied any work.

If you blow the engine somehow, it gets a little trickier, but even then, there is wiggle room. You will likely be out $, but it can be mitigated by a good dealer.

Also put aside a little $ every month (some sort of equity account, whatever you have), and have that to lean on if things go awry. I did and was glad I had when I spun my crank hub. That sucked, but would have been a lot worse without that $. It gave me some peace of mind. Just throwing that out there if you're concerned about it.

[josec70]

This topic has been beaten to death.

If you flash tune be prepared to pay if something goes wrong, plain and simple .. having a good relationship with your SA is not going to help one bit once BMW NA is involved as the tune is easily detectable. You more than likely will get flagged before you even have a problem.

A friendly SA will look the other way on many mods including a piggy or, at least, that has been my experience. I have had many piggys and have never had an issue or a warranty claim denied.

That does NOT mean it can't happen, just has not happened to me. A piggy will leave recorded data outside of factory parameters but is inferred and BMW will decide your fate based on the data they extract.

Conclusion:

There's a price to play the game ...

Flash tune is headache worth avoiding IMO but I would roll the dice with a piggy .. I would still remove it for service even with a friendly SA as you never know and it takes all of 5 min. My two F10 M5's both had piggys and I never removed them based on my long relationship with my SA. I didn't go with a piggy for my current M5C.

[Padfan9]

Originally Posted by kotik

Hello,

I'm considering leasing the new M5, and would like to up the power a bit, but during my recent visit to BMW with my M2C (which has BM3), the dealer told me that BMW released some kind of software that can detect if ECU was every modified... they said even if I take my tune off and relock ECU, they will be able to see it, and any engine issue/warranty claim on the engine, will be denied They said so far it doesn't seem to be able to detect JB4, but any true tunes will be detected and car will be flagged for life.

sooo yea... are you guys concerned about that? What about those on the lease? Say you don't blow the engine, and return the car from lease, and it used to have a tune, how does the dealer handle that?

Actually, I know someone who did a flash, put it back to stock and didn't even re lock dme and the dealer didn't see anything.

[LongBeachDinanFan]

Originally Posted by Padfan9

Actually, I know someone who did a flash, put it back to stock and didn't even re lock dme and the dealer didn't see anything.

Sometimes you get lucky and the dealer doesn't bother to check or finds it but doesn't do anything. Usually for any major claim, they are going to check carefully first. Especially these days.

[TrevorM3]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

Change your dealer and find one mod-friendly.

They have always had the technology to dig deeper for mods but 99% of dealerships don't care as long as you are not damaging the car

this is bullshit. You know very well if a blown motor comes into the dealer with a flash tune what happens.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by TrevorM3

this is bullshit. You know very well if a blown motor comes into the dealer with a flash tune what happens.

i got my turbos changed under warranty (2007 335i)

just to be clear, I'm not saying that if something major happens your dealership will not check just because you are friendly.
the odds of major components failing is close to zero. its more relevant to discuss the more likely scenario of minor components failing (either unrelated to your mods or spark plugs,etc..)

In the case, your car needs warranty work, if the mods are not related, most dealerships will do the warranty work without any issues (that's from my personal experience and working with thousands of customers over the years)

if your mods are related, expect to pay. You could get away with it, but it's unlikely.

[josec70]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

i got my turbos changed under warranty (2007 335i)

just to be clear, I'm not saying that if something major happens your dealership will not check just because you are friendly.
the odds of major components failing is close to zero. its more relevant to discuss the more likely scenario of minor components failing (either unrelated to your mods or spark plugs,etc..)

In the case, your car needs warranty work, if the mods are not related, most dealerships will do the warranty work without any issues (that's from my personal experience and working with thousands of customers over the years)

if your mods are related, expect to pay. You could get away with it, but it's unlikely.

Brother, I disagree.

The F10 M5 platform proved that major components fail and that the percentage is well above zero, especially in tuned cars, which is the topic at hand.

And when they fail, BMW will laugh as you foot the bill. A flagged car is carte blanche for BMW to deny most warranty claims, especially drivetrain issues, big or small.

Another overlooked issue is what happens on leased cars that are flagged.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by josec70

Brother, I disagree.

The F10 M5 platform proved that major components fail and that the percentage is well above zero, especially in tuned cars, which is the topic at hand.

And when they fail, BMW will laugh as you foot the bill. A flagged car is carte blanche for BMW to deny most warranty claims, especially drivetrain issues, big or small.

Another overlooked issue is what happens on leased cars that are flagged.

we'll agree to disagree

I'm stating my personal experience and what I have seen with thousands of customers. I have a full bolt-on M4 on a lease, all the work has been done at the dealerships without any issues.
if i have any major failure, i dont expect them to cover the bill. But then again i like my odds

As far as the components failing, considering the thousands of tuned M5, the odds have to be very close to zero when looking at the engine, transmission, or turbo failure.

[josec70]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

we'll agree to disagree

I'm stating my personal experience and what I have seen with thousands of customers. I have a full bolt-on M4 on a lease, all the work has been done at the dealerships without any issues.
if i have any major failure, i dont expect them to cover the bill. But then again i like my odds

As far as the components failing, considering the thousands of tuned M5, the odds have to be very close to zero when looking at the engine, transmission, or turbo failure.

I agree on the FBO and warranty coverage; many of my FBO M5's have been serviced at the dealer with no issues.

What I'm saying is that any major or minor issue resulting from a tune will not be covered. I'm also saying BMW has been very aggressive in flagging tuned cars. If you walk in to a dealership with a bent rod and are tuned good luck.

[GranitM5]

Originally Posted by josec70

I agree on the FBO and warranty coverage; many of my FBO M5's have been serviced at the dealer with no issues.

What I'm saying is that any major or minor issue resulting from a tune will not be covered. I'm also saying BMW has been very aggressive in flagging tuned cars. If you walk in to a dealership with a bent rod and are tuned good luck.

Is there a possibility of upgrading the rods to avoid bending one?

I had a C63 with the infamous headbolt issue and I upgraded the headbolts just for peace of mind. Wouldn't mind doing the same with the M5

[themnmd]

Originally Posted by LongBeachDinanFan

Sometimes you get lucky and the dealer doesn't bother to check or finds it but doesn't do anything. Usually for any major claim, they are going to check carefully first. Especially these days.

Yeah like you need a $10k engine repair,oh and we found you had a tune . Denied! Like people said elsewhere and here, you can do what you want to your car but it is always a risk.

[TrevorM3]

Originally Posted by GranitM5

Is there a possibility of upgrading the rods to avoid bending one?

I had a C63 with the infamous headbolt issue and I upgraded the headbolts just for peace of mind. Wouldn't mind doing the same with the M5

i would advise you to not touch anything. at all. if it breaks, take it in and let them fix it. After warranty, do as you please.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by josec70

What I'm saying is that any major or minor issue resulting from a tune will not be covered.

Completely agree

[BrntRubber]

Would high flow cats or a cstbsck exhaust impact the warranty of the engine or just those specific items?

[drjoe66]

It's your choice to tune. Why should BMW honor their warranty if you decide to tune?

[TrevorM3]

Originally Posted by drjoe66

It's your choice to tune. Why should BMW honor their warranty if you decide to tune?

As i have said in the past, BMW is the only fanbase that has come to expect this to "slide" for years. Audi, and Merc, totally different scene.

[drjoe66]

Originally Posted by TrevorM3

As i have said in the past, BMW is the only fanbase that has come to expect this to "slide" for years. Audi, and Merc, totally different scene.

Agreed. If you buy a car, you sign a contract. If you tune, you break the contract. So just accept the consequences. And that does not mean I have never had a tune......