[Bure@]

Got installed Eventuri intake today, after Dinan inlets and bmc drop in filters it’s a big difference. Intake noise and turbo whistle is more noticeable. Not sure about performance, I think it’s the same but under the hood looks very nice now 😉

[ResIpsaLoquitur]

Originally Posted by Bure@

Got installed Eventuri intake today, after Dinan inlets and bmc drop in filters it’s a big difference. Intake noise and turbo whistle is more noticeable. Not sure about performance, I think it’s the same but under the hood looks very nice now 😉

That looks REALLY good.

[Patton250]

Those look really good. I want to do it with my F 90 when I get it in a couple months. Here’s my question. Is there anyway on the planet earth a dealership could reject a warranty because of these intakes? Ive been meaning to start a thread on this, but it doesn’t hurt to ask here.

[Bure@]

Originally Posted by Patton250

Those look really good. I want to do it with my F 90 when I get it in a couple months. Here’s my question. Is there anyway on the planet earth a dealership could reject a warranty because of these intakes? Ive been meaning to start a thread on this, but it doesn’t hurt to ask here.

Should not be a problem but dealers are different. I am tuned so anyway in case of something my warranty will be voided 😀

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by Bure@

Should not be a problem but dealers are different. I am tuned so anyway in case of something my warranty will be voided 😀

I would love to do all that. This is such a powerful car and can be made quite a bit faster. However, going 0-60 in 3.2 seconds down to 2.8 seconds is not worth paying for a $50,000 motor. Besides I don’t think you can tune a 2023 anyway, right? I hope not because I would be so tempted.

Meanwhile, we have a guy on this forum that said he got denied a motor warranty because of downpipes. That’s why I’m asking about these intakes. I hope more people chime in.

[Bure@]

Originally Posted by Patton250

I would love to do all that. This is such a powerful car and can be made quite a bit faster. However, going 0-60 in 3.2 seconds down to 2.8 seconds is not worth paying for a $50,000 motor. Besides I don’t think you can tune a 2023 anyway, right? I hope not because I would be so tempted.

Meanwhile, we have a guy on this forum that said he got denied a motor warranty because of downpipes. That’s why I’m asking about these intakes. I hope more people chime in.

As long as you are happy with the car, I would keep it stock and sleep well 😀

[ResIpsaLoquitur]

Originally Posted by Patton250

I would love to do all that. This is such a powerful car and can be made quite a bit faster. However, going 0-60 in 3.2 seconds down to 2.8 seconds is not worth paying for a $50,000 motor. Besides I don't think you can tune a 2023 anyway, right? I hope not because I would be so tempted.

Meanwhile, we have a guy on this forum that said he got denied a motor warranty because of downpipes. That's why I'm asking about these intakes. I hope more people chime in.

There have been numerous lawsuits against BMW for denial of warranty claims for somewhat less invasive mods like these, with a pretty even split as to how they turn out for owners. Putting aside the merits of each individual's specific claim, the difference seems to be partially attributable to what states they are filed in. States with more robust consumer protection laws tend to skew more towards the customer, even perhaps in cases where if the consumer had filed that same meritorious claim in another state, they would have likely lost. Most of these lawsuits are filed against BMW NA in New Jersey, as this is their corporate HQ. New Jersey tends to be somewhat more pro consumer than some other states. However BMW arguably has enough of a presence in each of the 50 states such that they are likely to be able to be sued in all of them, and they are routinely sued from coast to coast and everywhere in between. I can recall off the top of my head two cases for less invasive mods where plaintiffs had extremely meritorious claims. For logistical reasons, plaintiffs in those actions filed in their home states (Colorado and South Dakota) and ultimately lost at trial with the courts siding with BMW. This is not surprising as the NCLC has ranked them as some of the most pro corporation states in the country. These are two examples where the outcome would have likely been different if plaintiffs elected to sue BMW in NJ (or even in Delaware, where BMW NA is incorporated).

The discovery and litigation processes over many lawsuits over many years, have revealed that BMW maintains a small department in Woodcliff Lake whose goal it is to essentially deny a claim whenever possible without causing legal issues for themselves, similar to insurance companies who maintain teams whose sole job it is to deny claims/avoid paying out on claims. It's also been shown that BMW is more aggressive in doing this than their other German counterparts (though Audi is up there, too).

These are not my opinions, they are facts. I am telling you all this to say that if BMW wants to find a way to deny your claim, they absolutely will, sometimes even in cases where they would likely lose if the action were to go to trial in the hopes that the consumer with extremely disparate resources/bargaining power as compared to BMW will just "let it go."

As everyone says on here, you've got to pay to play. There might very well be a good chance that the other forum member may have ultimately won if going to trial (and may even manage to get his claim covered without the headache and cost of litigation by aggressively pursuing BMW), but the consumer is starting out the gate impeded every time.

Sorry Bure@, no threadjacking intended! Just wanted to respond to Patton250's query.

[EM5C]

Originally Posted by ResIpsaLoquitur

There have been numerous lawsuits against BMW for denial of warranty claims for somewhat less invasive mods like these, with a pretty even split as to how they turn out for owners. Putting aside the merits of each individual's specific claim, the difference seems to be partially attributable to what states they are filed in. States with more robust consumer protection laws tend to skew more towards the customer, even perhaps in cases where if the consumer had filed that same meritorious claim in another state, they would have likely lost. Most of these lawsuits are filed against BMW NA in New Jersey as this is their corporate HQ. New Jersey tends to be somewhat more pro consumer than some other states. However BMW arguably has enough of a presence in each of the 50 states such that they are likely to be able to be sued in all of them, and they are routinely sued from coast to coast and everywhere in between. I can recall off the top of my head two cases for less invasive mods where plaintiffs had extremely meritorious claims. For logistical reasons, plaintiffs in those actions filed in their home states (Colorado and South Dakota) and ultimately lost at trial with the courts siding with BMW. This is not surprising as the NCLC has ranked them as some of the most pro corporation states in the country. These are two examples where the outcome would have likely been different if plaintiffs elected to sue BMW in NJ (or even in Delaware, where BMW NA is incorporated).

The discovery and litigation processes over many lawsuits over many years, have revealed that BMW [...]

Well said! Pay to play sums it up. I expect to assume all risk if I go down tuning/building this thing.

[Jakerx]

Looks good. I'm surprised they attached the light bar to your hood that way. Looks like an easy way to put a bunch of micro scratches in your PPF or paint.

[ResIpsaLoquitur]

Originally Posted by EM5C

Well said! Pay to play sums it up. I expect to assume all risk if I go down tuning/building this thing.

Thank you! Their MO is to flatly deny claims anywhere and everywhere possible. I'm not saying cars shouldn't modded, but if they are, the consumer must know that there could always be (warranty) trouble right around the corner, even for relatively less invasive mods such as this.

[Bure@]

I went to dealer today for coolant expansion tank under the warranty, they ordered the part, all good. My service advisor knows that my car is tuned, I asked him not to connect the computer. I don’t know what it’s going to be with bigger problem but so far so good.

[AHall]

Originally Posted by Bure@

I went to dealer today for coolant expansion tank under the warranty, they ordered the part, all good. My service advisor knows that my car is tuned, I asked him not to connect the computer. I don’t know what it’s going to be with bigger problem but so far so good.

What is the problem with the tank? Was it leaking and if so was it leaking from the tank seams or cap?

[Bure@]

Originally Posted by AHall

What is the problem with the tank? Was it leaking and if so was it leaking from the tank seams or cap?

From what I saw, the tank is sealed from 2 parts so it’s leaking a little bit in between. I have a friend with a shop and he changed couple of them, so looks like it’s a common issue.

[ResIpsaLoquitur]

Originally Posted by Bure@

I went to dealer today for coolant expansion tank under the warranty, they ordered the part, all good. My service advisor knows that my car is tuned, I asked him not to connect the computer. I don’t know what it’s going to be with bigger problem but so far so good.

That's excellent news! Great to hear!

[Patton250]

This is been a very helpful thread. Thanks guys. I’ve decided not to put these things on now. I wish BMW had some carbon fiber intakes that they authorized.

[A Need For Speed]

Originally Posted by Patton250

This is been a very helpful thread. Thanks guys. I’ve decided not to put these things on now. I wish BMW had some carbon fiber intakes that they authorized.

I have had Eventuri intake since day 1 and have never had an issue with my dealer. In fact they love the sound of the turbos w/the Eventuri. I think it would be very hard to prove that improved air flow killed an engine. It's in the same category as putting on a new exhaust. A minor mod at worst.

[Patton250]

Originally Posted by A Need For Speed

I have had Eventuri intake since day 1 and have never had an issue with my dealer. In fact they love the sound of the turbos w/the Eventuri. I think it would be very hard to prove that improved air flow killed an engine. It's in the same category as putting on a new exhaust. A minor mod at worst.

Did these deliver more power to the engine than stock intakes?

[A Need For Speed]

Originally Posted by Patton250

Did these deliver more power to the engine than stock intakes?

Yes but the increase is small, maybe 20 HP. Turbo sound is great tho.

[Maverik259]

Originally Posted by Patton250

This is been a very helpful thread. Thanks guys. I’ve decided not to put these things on now. I wish BMW had some carbon fiber intakes that they authorized.

wait what? What about this thread led you to not want to put on a simple intake?

keep in mind it also takes 45 min at worst to swap them back to stock if you have an engine problem and need to take it in.

Unless you have a shitty relationship with that dealer, more specifically your SA, then you would have nothing to worry about. ever.

As accurate as that long post about people suing BMW may have been, I dont believe it has a place in this conversation outside of a scare tactic. The ONLY thing you should take from that is simply BMW will always look for way's out of a warranty claim. that's the job of any company that puts the $ before their customers.

However, there are way more examples of bmw approving obscure warranty claims than denying them. It only gets hairy when we're talking entire engines.

[ResIpsaLoquitur]

Originally Posted by Maverik259

wait what? What about this thread led you to not want to put on a simple intake?

keep in mind it also takes 45 min at worst to swap them back to stock if you have an engine problem and need to take it in.

Unless you have a shitty relationship with that dealer, more specifically your SA, then you would have nothing to worry about. ever.

As accurate as that long post about people suing BMW may have been, I dont believe it has a place in this conversation outside of a scare tactic. The ONLY thing you should take from that is simply BMW will always look for way's out of a warranty claim. that's the job of any company that puts the $ before their customers.

However, there are way more examples of bmw approving obscure warranty claims than denying them. It only gets hairy when we're talking entire engines.

"Unless you have a shitty relationship with that dealer, more specifically your SA, then you would have nothing to worry about. ever."

That's a very absolute and incorrect statement. Stating that there is nothing to worry about ever is wrong on so many levels. BMW commonly flags cars for less invasive mods. Your statement and usage of the word "ever" implies that there has never been even one circumstance of BMW denying a warranty claim. That is obviously untrue. We hear of one every couple of months or so on here, and of course it happens in many more situations where it goes unreported. As knowledgeable as you are, you can not really think you can perform any mod on the car, and don't "ever" have to worry about BMW potentially denying a warranty claim.



"As accurate as that long post about people suing BMW may have been, I dont believe it has a place in this conversation outside of a scare tactic. The ONLY thing you should take from that is simply BMW will always look for way's out of a warranty claim. that's the job of any company that puts the $ before their customers."

First off, of course it's not a scare tactic. Being a scare tactic would imply I have a stake in the outcome of OP's decision. I do not work for, and never have worked for BMW. I have no reason whatsoever, nor an ulterior motive, to sway Patton250 to not getting an intake, or completing any other mod. I have no skin in the game here. I simply stated the facts about how BMW goes about assessing and then either approving or denying warranty claims. I didn't offer my take unprovoked on my own volition, I merely responded (accurately and factually!) to a question he posed. And of course companies like BMW want to protect their dollars, like any other company, but there a degrees. BMW tends to go more for denial comparatively than other manufacturers, especially as compared to Japanese brands as an example. What he wants to do is his prerogative.

You stated yourself that the only thing he should take out of my post is that BMW will try to get out of approving claims where they want to. I'm glad you see that because that was the sole point I was trying to make.

He asked whether he could run into a warranty issue, and I stated it's very possible he can, based on similar past cases. I was stating facts, not my opinion.



"However, there are way more examples of bmw approving obscure warranty claims than denying them. It only gets hairy when we're talking entire engines."

This contradicts your own statement above that there isn't going to be an issue "ever." And what are you basing your statement on? Anecdotal occurrences you are perhaps aware of? I'm not being harsh here; I'm genuinely asking what led you to your conclusion.

There are of course plenty of cases of BMW approving obscure warranty claims as you describe them. But there is always a chance he can fall into the larger group of ones that don't get covered. I was merely pointing this out, (again, at his request), so he could make an informed decision. The takeaway? You might very well be fine, you might very well get screwed. And again, it's his prerogative to do what he pleases with this information. But telling him he won't ever have a problem with coverage is misinformation.

EDIT — Almost forgot about the owner here on the M4 side of the house who was denied his Ultimate Care Coverage because he had…wait for it…spacers. Again, you can't honestly think they won't find any little way to deny you. This negates your point that you don't run into problems unless it's an engine replacement.

[Maverik259]

Originally Posted by ResIpsaLoquitur

"Unless you have a shitty relationship with that dealer, more specifically your SA, then you would have nothing to worry about. ever."

That's a very absolute and incorrect statement. Stating that there is nothing to worry about ever is wrong on so many levels. BMW commonly flags cars for less invasive mods. Your statement and usage of the word "ever" implies that there has never been even one circumstance of BMW denying a warranty claim. That is obviously untrue. We hear of one every couple of months or so on here, and of course it happens in many more situations where it goes unreported. As knowledgeable as you are, you can not really think you can perform any mod on the car, and don't "ever" have to worry about BMW potentially denying a warranty claim.



"As accurate as that long post about people suing BMW may have been, I dont believe it has a place in this conversation outside of a scare tactic. The ONLY thing you should take from that is simply BMW will always look for way's out of a warranty claim. that's the job of any company that puts the $ before their customers."

First off, of course it's not a scare tactic. Being a scare tactic would imply I have a stake in the outcome of OP's decision. I do not work for, and never have worked for BMW. I have no reason whatsoever, nor an ulterior motive, to sway Patton250 to not getting an intake, or completing any other mod. I have no skin in the game here. I simply stated the facts about how BMW goes about assessing and then either approving or denying warranty claims. I [...]

Ok can’t lie. This is way to much to read or respond to all of it.

Highlights, I stand by my statement about the service advisor. If you have a food relationship you aren’t going to get flagged for an intake. Engine mods are different and I would never take my car into the dealer with certain aftermarket items if I had a cel and the code reference an air intake issue. Like im dealing with right now regarding my turbo inlets.

As far as warranty claims I would need further details that’s just his ultimate service was denied due to spacers. My reference ro obscure warranty claims is dealer dependent. Not bmw as a whole. So many stories in my X5 days of guys getting warranty claims on wheels for corrosion and leather seat failure and even the damn lower control seems being replaced under warranty. My dealer laughed in my face when I tried though. But many got them covered.

And yes I believe your super long story about bmw getting sued and denying claims was a scare tactic. Certainly don’t think you were lieing. However I don’t think that example belongs in the discussion regarding an intake.
BM3 tune or piggyback. Absolutely.

And yes I do agree BMW “can” do whatever they want and there’s no telling. I think they’re all a bunch of morons in the service department and crooks in the sales department. Lol

[ResIpsaLoquitur]

Originally Posted by Maverik259

Ok can't lie. This is way to much to read or respond to all of it.

Highlights, I stand by my statement about the service advisor. If you have a food relationship you aren't going to get flagged for an intake. Engine mods are different and I would never take my car into the dealer with certain aftermarket items if I had a cel and the code reference an air intake issue. Like im dealing with right now regarding my turbo inlets.

As far as warranty claims I would need further details that's just his ultimate service was denied due to spacers. My reference ro obscure warranty claims is dealer dependent. Not bmw as a whole. So many stories in my X5 days of guys getting warranty claims on wheels for corrosion and leather seat failure and even the damn lower control seems being replaced under warranty. My dealer laughed in my face when I tried though. But many got them covered.

And yes I believe your super long story about bmw getting sued and denying claims was a scare tactic. Certainly don't think you were lieing. However I don't think that example belongs in the discussion regarding an intake.
BM3 tune or piggyback. Absolutely.

And yes I do agree BMW "can" do whatever they want and there's no telling. I think they're all a bunch of morons in the service department and crooks in the sales department. Lol

If the most severe criticism you can levy against my argument is it's length, then that's pretty good!

I do have a good relationship with my SA. In fact I take him whiskey at Christmas and anytime he does me a favor, and he's done a lot. I know by your own admission on here that you think that taking Christmas gifts to your SA is "weird," but things like that help to foster a good relationship. However, some things are just above his pay grade. There are inevitably some things that he cannot turn a blind eye to, even if he wanted. This hasn't happened with me — I'm bone stock except for RaceChip which I fully remove any time I go in for service — but I know of issues with other clients of his that he would have turned a blind eye to if he could have, but he was not able to. If a shop tech or foreman sees something, and wants to go straight to the SM, there may be little an SA can do to prevent that. And there are certainly some SAs who will not turn a blind eye to things.

You're talking about dealers, but when dealers deny warranty claims, there are people who will get pissed and try to go up the chain, so it's very possible that an issue like that ends up in front of BMW NA anyway.

We can agree to disagree to disagree on a lot of these points. Reasonable people can disagree, and I truly love having the dialogue. People are entitled to their own opinions! What I absolutely cannot understand for the life of me however is why you would think I was trying to scare him! He asked a simple question, and I responded LOL. Its not like I went and created a thread saying all that out of nowhere!