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      02-08-2019, 03:23 PM   #45
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Originally Posted by jeffscott1 View Post
Here you go, here is 2016 that stickered for 20k + less than a 2019 comp with 41k miles for 59k. The 2019 is a far superior vehicle and should hold its value a little better than the 2016. I can send links for dozens more.
You are comparing a list price a dealer has for a car (which is still is not in mid-60s originally mentioned, the dealer can add CPO warranty to it upping the price, and can certainly be negotiated) with what we can sell or trade in.

If United BMW (and I have traded an M4 there) lists something for $58k that means they got it for probably upper $40s to $50k from whoever traded that in at the most.
Here are a few more
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      02-08-2019, 03:27 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by jeffscott1 View Post
Here are a few more
Again you are comparing dealer list prices with what we would be able to sell the same for or what the dealer will finally sell it for.
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      02-08-2019, 03:28 PM   #47
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Dude, just admit you shouldn't have made such an ignorant blanket statement and move on. Life's too short.
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      02-08-2019, 03:33 PM   #48
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stav View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeffscott1 View Post
Here are a few more
Again you are comparing dealer list prices with what we would be able to sell the same for or what the dealer will finally sell it for.
You say dealers are paying 40k for low mile 2016 M5s. You find me a low mile 2016 M5 for 40k, I will buy it and pay you a $5,000.00 finders fee.'

Here's a few private sellers
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      02-08-2019, 03:44 PM   #49
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Originally Posted by jeffscott1 View Post
You say dealers are paying 40k for low mile 2016 M5s. You find me a low mile 2016 M5 for 40k, I will buy it and pay you a $5,000.00 finders fee.'

Here's a few private sellers
Read again what I specifically said for the specific listing you presented:

"If United BMW (and I have traded an M4 there) lists something for $58k that means they got it for probably upper $40s to $50k from whoever traded that in at the most."
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      02-09-2019, 11:25 AM   #50
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Does it concern you?
I achieved over £20K discount on my incoming and am more than happy with the deal, will obviously take a hit further down the line but at least will be in it and enjoying the beast

The F90s already being discounted to the tune of £20K, was that with Stratstone in your neck of the woods ?, if that the case it'll be 0% time soon at which point I shall buy one
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      02-09-2019, 12:16 PM   #51
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The F90s already being discounted to the tune of £20K, was that with Stratstone in your neck of the woods ?, if that the case it'll be 0% time soon at which point I shall buy one
No not Stratstone, most dealers are offering big discounts, this last week has seen even more offers, Marshels have good deals on
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      02-09-2019, 12:43 PM   #52
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Got £23k off my M5C. Very happy with the deal and cost of ownership over the 3 years I will have it.

Early adopters who paid at or near list will take a heavy hit. But given what happened on the f10 they would have known that.
Hi Stash,
Was this on a new Comp Pack or slightly used ?, sounds like a great discount.
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      02-09-2019, 12:49 PM   #53
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Originally Posted by Stash21 View Post
Got £23k off my M5C. Very happy with the deal and cost of ownership over the 3 years I will have it.

Early adopters who paid at or near list will take a heavy hit. But given what happened on the f10 they would have known that.
I've had mine 8 months and paid £80K so happy it has CCB's too.
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      02-09-2019, 02:46 PM   #54
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If you lease, that's basically all you're paying for. Eliminates the unknowns.
I see this statement all the time on this board. My math says that a 3 year lease will cost you about $60,000.00 plus any lease end penalties they hit you with. I paid 115k cash for my 135k M5 comp, 2016 M5s are selling for mid 60s, the F90 should hold its value better than the older version.
Let's say it's worth 70,000.00 with 20 to 30k miles. My cost of ownership is 45k )115k- 70k) over the 3 years. Even if I am off by 10k paying cash is still cheaper and I am not stuck in the car for 3 years.
Where are you seeing the mid 60s for 2016 M5s? There are many on cars.com for low 50s and that is without any negotiation. This is without considering the time you have to spend dealing with selling it.

The fact about the lease is that BMW is taking all the risk - saying for example than in 3 years they will be able to sell it for 60%, the residual. If the car is worth more then you can buy it and sell it yourself. I did this with my last M4.

If the value tanks though you can just walk away (or even lease transfer it much before the 3 years).

Lease is just another method of financing that comes with insurance which you pay a fee for but is minimal.

Also buying in most states you pay substantial taxes upfront where with the lease you only pay taxes on monthly payment.

Why somebody would want to tie $120k upfront when this other financing vehicle called lease is available is really beyond me - unless planning to keep it for a long long time.
Tax laws vary by state with regards to lease. In places like TX and VA and several other states, you still have to pay the full tax upfront even if you lease. So all that factors in also.
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      02-09-2019, 02:53 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by utsteve98 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stav View Post
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Originally Posted by jeffscott1 View Post
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Originally Posted by windtendo View Post
If you lease, that's basically all you're paying for. Eliminates the unknowns.
I see this statement all the time on this board. My math says that a 3 year lease will cost you about $60,000.00 plus any lease end penalties they hit you with. I paid 115k cash for my 135k M5 comp, 2016 M5s are selling for mid 60s, the F90 should hold its value better than the older version.
Let's say it's worth 70,000.00 with 20 to 30k miles. My cost of ownership is 45k )115k- 70k) over the 3 years. Even if I am off by 10k paying cash is still cheaper and I am not stuck in the car for 3 years.
Where are you seeing the mid 60s for 2016 M5s? There are many on cars.com for low 50s and that is without any negotiation. This is without considering the time you have to spend dealing with selling it.

The fact about the lease is that BMW is taking all the risk - saying for example than in 3 years they will be able to sell it for 60%, the residual. If the car is worth more then you can buy it and sell it yourself. I did this with my last M4.

If the value tanks though you can just walk away (or even lease transfer it much before the 3 years).

Lease is just another method of financing that comes with insurance which you pay a fee for but is minimal.

Also buying in most states you pay substantial taxes upfront where with the lease you only pay taxes on monthly payment.

Why somebody would want to tie $120k upfront when this other financing vehicle called lease is available is really beyond me - unless planning to keep it for a long long time.
Tax laws vary by state with regards to lease. In places like TX and VA and several other states, you still have to pay the full tax upfront even if you lease. So all that factors in also.
Yes that is why I said most states and not all. I believe there are only 4-5 that have upfront tax rules and/or based on full price.
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      02-09-2019, 05:37 PM   #56
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      02-18-2019, 03:37 AM   #57
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Hi Stash,
Was this on a new Comp Pack or slightly used ?, sounds like a great discount.
brand new in stock, was very happy with the deal.
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      02-18-2019, 06:15 AM   #58
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brand new in stock, was very happy with the deal.
I managed £20,750 off my Comp Pack, which i was happy with. We have bought them right, straight from the off imho
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      02-18-2019, 11:12 AM   #59
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My F10 m5 burned to the ground (woolsey Fire). I got a full settlement for it. It was a 2015 w/comp, cc brakes, Msrp ~120k, i think I paid 109k for it. It had been on a dealer lot for a while. It had about 26k miles when it took up smoking! I got $63k (not including taxes) for it in December of 18. It was purchased August of ‘15. That is basically private party value. So apply whatever discounting system you want to figure out what a dealer would take it as a trade.

Using my company’s instant cash value from multiple dealers put it in the low $50k. You could probably negotiate up a little from that. Call it $55-$57k for trade in.
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      02-18-2019, 08:52 PM   #60
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Originally Posted by jeffscott1 View Post
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Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP View Post
The other option is buying a used car around the same price as the new F90 m5 that has already depreciated.....example a Rolls Royce ghost or G63 amg?

BMW's lose way too much value but again....there is no better 4 door sedan!
I totally agree, I paid 120k for my 2014 Flying Spur V12 last year it had an MSRP of 270k and it had 5500 miles on it
wow
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      02-18-2019, 08:53 PM   #61
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This thread has exceeded its shelf life.
I it has depreciated
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      02-18-2019, 08:56 PM   #62
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This thread has exceeded its shelf life.
I it has depreciated
LOL
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      02-18-2019, 10:46 PM   #63
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Originally Posted by Elanderholm View Post
My F10 m5 burned to the ground (woolsey Fire). I got a full settlement for it. It was a 2015 w/comp, cc brakes, Msrp ~120k, i think I paid 109k for it. It had been on a dealer lot for a while. It had about 26k miles when it took up smoking! I got $63k (not including taxes) for it in December of 18. It was purchased August of '15. That is basically private party value. So apply whatever discounting system you want to figure out what a dealer would take it as a trade.

Using my company's instant cash value from multiple dealers put it in the low $50k. You could probably negotiate up a little from that. Call it $55-$57k for trade in.
Sorry for your loss ... The F10 and assuming your house too ... This fire and now flood/mudslide season is surly something for the books.

It appears you've be made "whole" or at least satisfied with the insurance settlement on your F10.

If your house has been damaged or destroyed I just hope that part of the process goes well too.
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      02-20-2019, 12:29 AM   #64
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brand new in stock, was very happy with the deal.
UK dealers will be offering big discounts to get rid of their stock cars before March ends. £25k plus off M5C will be achievable.
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      02-20-2019, 12:35 AM   #65
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UK dealers will be offering big discounts to get rid of their stock cars before March ends. £25k plus off M5C will be achievable.
With the pound taking a pounding, its no wonder!
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      02-20-2019, 01:25 AM   #66
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No doubt that buying may make sense for some folks and there's a "possibility" that it may cost less to own versus lease in some scenarios.

The picture becomes more muddled when you factor the cost of tying up capital, tax benefits of leasing and the "what if" scenarios that can diminish value on a car you own (accident, major repairs etc.).

There's no right answer here since every owner really evaluates what works best for him or her.

I choose to lease because when I factor in some of the points mentioned above, the true price of ownership is substantially less than buying and it removes the "what ifs" from the equation.

With that said, do whatever the f*ck makes you happy LOL.
Even without the tax benefits, you will have to factor in the cost of capital in buy vs lease. For example, the $115k you paid up front comes with an opportunity cost as you can invest it in safe investment and earn 4%-6% easily. I would say the savings would be marginal.

That being said I chose to buy the car simply because I like owning my car and not worry about the dealership. Not for financial reason per se.
Next thing you know we will be adding IRR in to the calculation. The interest loss will be similar when you consider you are 15k more out of pocket not counting the 5 to 10k down you need to put to get to a reasonable payment.

If the car is damaged or in an accident you are responsible for the loss of value to the lease company at the end of the lease.

The primary reason why people lease a car like this is because it is the only way they can afford it.
The primary reason for leasing is that most people don't have 100k in cash, period.

I've never leased and tend to buy it because I like the idea that it's mine. Most of the time cash but sometimes cash and loan. BMW offered cash incentives to borrow and only 2.5% interest seamed like free money. I can get 5-7% in relatively safe 3-5 year investments.
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