[m_fife]

There has been a lot of speculation in many threads on how BMW detects tuning flash and piggybacks. In this thread (https://f90.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1932870) I got the idea to run the tune detection job in ISTA on my M5 and review the logs, as I am not (and have not) been tuned I've got no issue running the job.

Before we get into the log files I want to give a quick background on how BMW does tune detection it is a 2-step process. The first happens the moment they plug the car in and ISTA downloads the FASTA data. An initial tuning check is run, if this flags as tuning possible I believe it will add TDX03 to the Vehicle Order (VO). This is similar to the TD1/TB1/TG1/TE1 process with Audis.

If the initial tuning check suspects tuning, the tech will run ABL-DIT-AS1214_TD_BASIC (See screenshots). This will conduct a detailed data pull from every module in the car, it took 30 minutes on my car over ENET (may be faster with an ICOM).

When everything is done ISTA will compile a .zip.log data package containing many log files. The most relevant file is the IstaOperation log. It contains both the initial operation (in cleartext) and the data dump (raw data). So here we go:

Initial Check:
2022-07-08 12:34:06.940 INFO [T] ISTA: [16] ABL_GEN_AG9999_TD_IDENT.Datenauslesen_und_Auswerte n_VM() - LogStatement. StructuredString: Tuning detection suspicion criteria (Pre). StructureElementValues: tuning suspicion code :000000000000 0: engine ecu CAL-ID | CVN:9CF5E197 | 9CF5E197 (WH: 39318 / MM: False / low-Ilevel: False)
1: engine ecu BTLD CAL-ID | CVN:F29CDEE9 | F29CDEE9
1: engine ecu SWFK CAL-ID | CVN:9277591A | 9277591A
1: engine ecu SWFL CAL-ID | CVN:11F09478 | 11F09478
2: tuning DTCs detected in engine fault memory:no DTC found
3: tuning DTCs detected in engine secondary fault memory :no DTC found
4: programing counter engine ecu: (job answer | threshold):2 | 7.613 5: programing counter engine ecu: (calculated):2
6: calculated reprogramming engine ecu: (calculated):no flashback
7: max. temperatures in the exhaust line (TOXIPRE | TPRE): DDE8 diesel only
8: plug and play variante suspected : V1, FS: 0 / 7, IS: 0 / 5 |
8: plug and play DTCs suspected :FS: - ; IS: - |
9: speed average in relation to operating hours [km | 6 min digit | km/h]:26130 | 39318 | 6.64581107889516
10: PE [det | all]:0 | 2
11: manual detection or exclusion :- x: reason for TDX03:no reason

As for the raw data I'm going to need some help from some computer science gurus as I don't know how to do the raw byte - hexadecimal thing. If someone wants to help out I can send you the logs. I do know that once the data has been pulled it is uploaded to BMW and viewed online using a system called FBM (https://www.e90post.com/forums/showthread.php?t=651281).

I was initially going to upload the logs to the world but 1. they are too large for BimmerPost (IstaOperation log is 28mb) and I've removed my VIN from all the files, but I'm pretty sure it is stored in the raw data somewhere.

I hope this was informative for everyone and someone can help out with the detailed check.

[onfireX5]

Cool info.

Is your M5 bone stock ?

[m_fife]

Originally Posted by onfireX5

Cool info.

Is your M5 bone stock ?

Yes.

[onfireX5]

Would be killer to see the same test with a basic , No obd2 plug box like RaceChip to see if it actually flags it at the end.

Cool stuff.

[crypto]

You can send me the log and I'll try and make sense of any encoded data. If it's just hex encoded (base16) then it's a super trivial to decode.

[m_fife]

Originally Posted by crypto

You can send me the log and I'll try and make sense of any encoded data. If it's just hex encoded (base16) then it's a super trivial to decode.

PM Sent

[DrivenAgain]

you can be flagged an denied by boost increase alone, bmw doesnt have to see a tune

[m_fife]

Originally Posted by DrivenAgain

you can be flagged an denied by boost increase alone, bmw doesnt have to see a tune

That pretty obvious. The bigger question we are trying to solve is the Piggy backs that report stock boost to the DME. I want to nail down all the parameters that are monitored.

[onfireX5]

This pic in your post is also interesting. Would love to see that test on a RaceChip car but with the bypass plug in the harness.

[Maverik259]

Originally Posted by onfireX5

This pic in your post is also interesting. Would love to see that test on a RaceChip car but with the bypass plug in the harness.

I have ISTA and RC. Haven't a clue how to run this test though haha. Haven't used ISTA on the M yet.

[onfireX5]

Originally Posted by Maverik259

I have ISTA and RC. Haven't a clue how to run this test though haha. Haven't used ISTA on the M yet.

You can do it !

[m_fife]

Originally Posted by Maverik259

I have ISTA and RC. Haven't a clue how to run this test though haha. Haven't used ISTA on the M yet.

Based on ISTA 4.36

1. Operations -> New -> Read Out Vehicle Data -> Continue Identification
2. Vehicle Management
3. Service Functions
4. Power Train -> Engine Electronics -> Automated Engine Tuning Test
5. Yes -> Continue

Once ABL is completed:

6. Operations -> Active
7. Select the active Operation -> Close operation
8. Close Operation -> OK

Log Files are created in two locations:

FASTA Data (This is the log for the initial scan of the car when it is identified:

\ISTA\FASTAOut\ ***VIN***_DATETIME.BEHDAT (and/or FSTDAT).
These files can be viewed in the Ista Protocol Viewer. I have found that there is more information (specifically tuning information) that is contained in the file that IS NOT shown in the protocol viewer.

ISTA Log Files:

\ISTA\Logs\ DATE_F90_VIN.zip.log (Change to .zip and uncompress). The files you are looking for are listed in the initial post.

Can't wait to see the comparison!

[onfireX5]

Originally Posted by m_fife

Based on ISTA 4.36

1. Operations -> New -> Read Out Vehicle Data -> Continue Identification
2. Vehicle Management
3. Service Functions
4. Power Train -> Engine Electronics -> Automated Engine Tuning Test
5. Yes -> Continue

Once ABL is completed:

6. Operations -> Active
7. Select the active Operation -> Close operation
8. Close Operation -> OK

Log Files are created in two locations:

FASTA Data (This is the log for the initial scan of the car when it is identified:

\ISTA\FASTAOut\ ***VIN***_DATETIME.BEHDAT (and/or FSTDAT).
These files can be viewed in the Ista Protocol Viewer. I have found that there is more information (specifically tuning information) that is contained in the file that IS NOT shown in the protocol viewer.

ISTA Log Files:

\ISTA\Logs\ DATE_F90_VIN.zip.log (Change to .zip and uncompress). The files you are looking for are listed in the initial post.

Can't wait to see the comparison!

Boom ! There it is ! Plug in the bypass and run it !

[m_fife]

Originally Posted by onfireX5

Boom ! There it is ! Plug in the bypass and run it !

While it will be interesting to see the results I still would never recommend leaving it in. See #11 from the original post "manual detection."

Additionally, the tune detection went from version 21 to 22 from 4.35 to 4.36 so we need to know what version is being used.

[Maverik259]

Originally Posted by m_fife

While it will be interesting to see the results I still would never recommend leaving it in. See #11 from the original post "manual detection."

Additionally, the tune detection went from version 21 to 22 from 4.35 to 4.36 so we need to know what version is being used.

Hmm Good point. I don't have the most up to date I guess. Mines older. So assume I could've run the test?

[Boosted_8]

Thank so much for taking the time to post. As per the other thread I'm struggling to think what is measurable as proof of a piggy running. There's so many other scenarios that could ask for a few more pounds of boost from the ECU e.g. operation at high altitude. I expect it's going to be difficult to pin down a smoking gun. I imagine the best they can do is look at waste gate duty. Injector duty and grammes per second of air as a circumstance for consistent extra output from the engine.

[m_fife]

Originally Posted by Boosted_8

Thank so much for taking the time to post. As per the other thread I'm struggling to think what is measurable as proof of a piggy running. There's so many other scenarios that could ask for a few more pounds of boost from the ECU e.g. operation at high altitude. I expect it's going to be difficult to pin down a smoking gun. I imagine the best they can do is look at waste gate duty. Injector duty and grammes per second of air as a circumstance for consistent extra output from the engine.

You gotta think outside the box. We are talking upwards of $40k for a blown engine and BMW is not going to shell that out lightly. They know the family values for every sensor in that engine. It is all mapped out. They've tested in every environment - desert, sub zero, city roads, and of course the ring. They know every inch of that car from 0-30 city driving all the way to probably beyond the limit on the track. Anything that is considered out of family could be grounds for warranty denial. We are trying to determine what values are collected initially and with the followup scan. My next question is what triggers all the tuning codes referenced in the initial scan.

[Boosted_8]

Originally Posted by m_fife

You gotta think outside the box. We are talking upwards of $40k for a blown engine and BMW is not going to shell that out lightly. They know the family values for every sensor in that engine. It is all mapped out. They've tested in every environment - desert, sub zero, city roads, and of course the ring. They know every inch of that car from 0-30 city driving all the way to probably beyond the limit on the track. Anything that is considered out of family could be grounds for warranty denial. We are trying to determine what values are collected initially and with the followup scan. My next question is what triggers all the tuning codes referenced in the initial scan.

I'm onboard

Points of interest
1) As per the scanning description in the screen shots above: Load, how is the ECU evaluating it? In the last ECU I poked around inside (Mazda) the logic flow was as follows -

2) Exhaust gas opacity, is that jargon for how rich and hot the exhaust emissions are? I assume this is a combo input from o2 and EGT sensors?

[Boosted_8]

Oh almost for got. 3) The description also states: The Drivetrain only accepts a maximum defined torque input. This one could be pretty clear cut by asking the TCU what its witnessing as the input nm / ftlbs

[ziomur]

Hi guys, i'm new here. I need , if possible, know some info about how work automated tuning test. I'm from Italy. I see from italian forums that original FASTA is downloaded from German server and match with local FASTA car. I'd like know which flags, registers, etc are compared. If automated is "passed" with no tuning, the operator can decide to procede with manual test or bypass it and owerwrite the ECU? Thank you so much if someone will answer.

Best regards.
zio

P.s. have patience with my language ^_^

[m_fife]

Originally Posted by ziomur

Hi guys, i'm new here. I need , if possible, know some info about how work automated tuning test. I'm from Italy. I see from italian forums that original FASTA is downloaded from German server and match with local FASTA car. I'd like know which flags, registers, etc are compared. If automated is "passed" with no tuning, the operator can decide to procede with manual test or bypass it and owerwrite the ECU? Thank you so much if someone will answer.

Best regards.
zio

P.s. have patience with my language ^_^

If the automated test passes there is no reason for the tech to run the manual test. While we were able to download the FASTA data we were unable to decipher it so far due to possible encryption or proprietary language.

[pbonsalb]

When I plug in my Launch x431 PAD V, it says tune suspected. I have a tune. It’s a high level tool but BMW factory is higher level so I don’t know how you would fool the BMW tool.