[r33_RGSport]

Got reply from Germany.
Unfortunately, they don't have answer for me.
I am not sure why, but maybe it is their secret sauce to the product.

But, to answer Steeve19M5CP question.
RaceChip is TUV approved company and so is their products.
TUV is much more strict than DOT or EPA or CARB combined.
So, in order to have their product released and certified, it has to pass TUV testing procedure.
Another thing, in Germany, they do warranty the engine similar to Dinan in the US. Since BMWNA operates differently than BMWEU, RaceChip unable to offer the same in the US.

Now, the beauty of piggy back unit, RaceChip or any other that doesn't intercept signal other than the boost sensors.
Your engine is still well protected with the DME/ECU. IF there is too much boost, which causing it to run too lean, the DME/ECU will knock out the whole car into a Limp Mode.

It was the case with previous generation of RaceChip product, where you can change the boost manually beyond the limit. Similar to BMS JB+ where you can adjust the dial on board to change boost gain value.

While on the new Generation of RaceChip product, the firmware set the limit.
You can't go beyond Map 7 since Map 7 is the highest already.
In order to do more, I will need to do datalog with the gas that you are running, send the data to Germany to create custom firmware.

I hope I able to clarify some issues here.

[soooma]

Originally Posted by r33_RGSport

Got reply from Germany.
Unfortunately, they don't have answer for me.
I am not sure why, but maybe it is their secret sauce to the product.

But, to answer Steeve19M5CP question.
RaceChip is TUV approved company and so is their products.
TUV is much more strict than DOT or EPA or CARB combined.
So, in order to have their product released and certified, it has to pass TUV testing procedure.
Another thing, in Germany, they do warranty the engine similar to Dinan in the US. Since BMWNA operates differently than BMWEU, RaceChip unable to offer the same in the US.

Now, the beauty of piggy back unit, RaceChip or any other that doesn't intercept signal other than the boost sensors.
Your engine is still well protected with the DME/ECU. IF there is too much boost, which causing it to run too lean, the DME/ECU will knock out the whole car into a Limp Mode.

It was the case with previous generation of RaceChip product, where you can change the boost manually beyond the limit. Similar to BMS JB+ where you can adjust the dial on board to change boost gain value.

While on the new Generation of RaceChip product, the firmware set the limit.
You can't go beyond Map 7 since Map 7 is the highest already.
In order to do more, I will need to do datalog with the gas that you are running, send the data to Germany to create custom firmware.

I hope I able to clarify some issues here.

Despite not buying the "Secret sauce"
But thanks for reply
I am waiting

On another note,
Most Dynos showed that M5 Non Comp F90 is a 675-680 BHP car and with RC GTS SHOULD be in the 750 range?! And torque?!
Ebat about Comp package M5 does it get more?!

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP

Knowing how much boost PSI is increased for each map is critical for engine safety.....example if there is too much boost in some cases you need to run race fuel.......why doesnt anyone know how much PSI increase is set on the RC for each map?

with JB4 it is very clear see the first post for info;

https://www.n54tech.com/forums/showp...41&postcount=1

Originally Posted by soooma

Depakote not buying the "Secret sauce"
But thanks for reply
I am waiting

On another note,
Most Dynos showed that M5 Non Comp F90 is a 675-680 BHP car and with RC GTS SHOULD be in the 750 range?! And torque?!
Ebat about Comp package M5 does it get more?!

Comp Package should get more.
Turbo engine usually gain a little more torque than hp.

[MV99]

Originally Posted by soooma

Depakote not buying the "Secret sauce"
But thanks for reply
I am waiting

On another note,
Most Dynos showed that M5 Non Comp F90 is a 675-680 BHP car and with RC GTS SHOULD be in the 750 range?! And torque?!
Ebat about Comp package M5 does it get more?!

Map 7 torque should be around 675 and your estimate of power is about right. It is very detectable to feel the extra pull and quicker response to throttle input.

As for CP verion, since it is the same engine, there could be no additional gain. Map 7 will equal the engine performance between two version. However, on top of improvement in engine, CP version addresses certain other areas to make it better performer on track.

Mine was built before CP available, so I went for Racechip to get more enjoyment when WOT. I cherish my daughter's winter break back from UCLA and my RachChiped F90 got me her big smile while enjoying couple of launches......

[akant540]

Is there issues with warranty...just leased new comp f90 m5 today and my service advisor said yes

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by akant540

Is there issues with warranty...just leased new comp f90 m5 today and my service advisor said yes

I guess you only can enjoy it the way it is.
At least it has plenty of hp stock already.

[Steeve19M5CP]

Originally Posted by r33_RGSport

I guess you only can enjoy it the way it is.
At least it has plenty of hp stock already.

yes 625whp+ stock (725-750HP) is great for daily driving.....any tuning or piggyback automatically voids BMW warranty except Dinan (some people dont mind taking the risk)

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP

yes 625whp+ stock (725-750HP) is great for daily driving.....any tuning or piggyback automatically voids BMW warranty except Dinan (some people dont mind taking the risk)

That's the name of the game, right?
The more you risk you are willing to take, the better the reward.
Not only in car mods, life in general too.

[soooma]

Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP

yes 625whp+ stock (725-750HP) is great for daily driving.....any tuning or piggyback automatically voids BMW warranty except Dinan (some people dont mind taking the risk)

So they are able to trace that even if removed?!
So probably too late for me ?!

[Miko M]

Originally Posted by r33_RGSport

That's the name of the game, right?
The more you risk you are willing to take, the better the reward.
Not only in car mods, life in general too.

Agreed

[marcvtec]

I'll bite in this thread.
The racechip fools the MAF sensor into thinking that that car can have more boost, which in turn activates the rest of the system to add more fuel and maybe timing. Maybe timing again. ?
And fully relies on riding the OEM knock sensors for feed back. If it even has that capability to reduce after knock is determined, lol.
good luck.
My bet is when is knocks it already at your door, and this little chip did not pull back timing when needed

Personally I would wait for a flash tune that is custom based on your needs, (mods).

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by marcvtec

I'll bite in this thread.
The racechip fools the MAF sensor into thinking that that car can have more boost, which in turn activates the rest of the system to add more fuel and maybe timing. Maybe timing again. ?
And fully relies on riding the OEM knock sensors for feed back. If it even has that capability to reduce after knock is determined, lol.
good luck.
My bet is when is knocks it already at your door, and this little chip did not pull back timing when needed

Personally I would wait for a flash tune that is custom based on your needs, (mods).

What you are writing is correct, in term on how piggyback tunes work in general.
That's what difference RaceChip to some other brands.
The max boost gain are pre-set based on their R&D process.
It is not something that you can just crank up the boost until you fight the DME.
That's how people blew their motors back in the day with HKS EVC which tricks the vacuum system of the Turbo system.

While some other piggyback brand allows end-user to change the boost target by themselves.
While some are setting the boost target aggressively high to get more sales by claiming more hp gain than others without doing a proper R&D.

Not saying that DME flash tune is bad, you just need to understand it better and know what you are getting yourself into.
Understanding AFR and timing is one thing, but to properly tune an engine, there are more into it.
Maybe the DME tuners can explain more, I hope they are willing to share info.

[soooma]

Originally Posted by r33_RGSport

What you are writing is correct, in term on how piggyback tunes work in general.
That's what difference RaceChip to some other brands.
The max boost gain are pre-set based on their R&D process.
It is not something that you can just crank up the boost until you fight the DME.
That's how people blew their motors back in the day with HKS EVC which tricks the vacuum system of the Turbo system.

While some other piggyback brand allows end-user to change the boost target by themselves.
While some are setting the boost target aggressively high to get more sales by claiming more hp gain than others without doing a proper R&D.

Not saying that DME flash tune is bad, you just need to understand it better and know what you are getting yourself into.
Understanding AFR and timing is one thing, but to properly tune an engine, there are more into it.
Maybe the DME tuners can explain more, I hope they are willing to share info.

I still don't really understand how Race Chip really works

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by soooma

I still don't really understand how Race Chip really works

It tricks the boost sensor data, like any other piggies.
Some tricking more sensors, some less sensors.

It is like a cook tricking your taste buds with some spices.

[soooma]

Originally Posted by r33_RGSport

It tricks the boost sensor data, like any other piggies.
Some tricking more sensors, some less sensors.

It is like a cook tricking your taste buds with some spices.

Ad this begets more boost from turbos ? Like PSI 21.5 like I have been reading?! And why doesn't it matter piggy vs DME, for I hear people talk about Piggy Turbo extra boost is a little late or not as Flash tune?

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by soooma

Ad this begets more boost from turbos ? Like PSI 21.5 like I have been reading?! And why doesn't it matter piggy vs DME, for I hear people talk about Piggy Turbo extra boost is a little late or not as Flash tune?

Yes, from that tricked signal, the turbo pushing more boost as much as the information given by the piggies.

Now as far as boost delay, I only can think that it probably caused by a slow processor speed of the piggies, not caused by the piggy system design itself.

While DME ECU Flash, it is different ball game.
Technically you can't compare the two on the performance.
DME ECU Flash is remapping to make the engine function the way you want it.
Doing it right, you will be good. Doing it wrong, you will be toast.
A good flash map creator need to know more than just AFR.

PS: Not saying that DME ECU Flash is bad. Just not my cup of tea playing with fire on daily/lease vehicle/on-road car.
Besides, it is funny when most are worry about warranty, but then pulling a trigger on flash tune.

The whole idea about piggies are to have fun with ease and safety parameters that has been set in the ECU by the car's manufacturer who designed the car.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Hi OP,
Are you asking about boot levels? Both can give you same power since you can just adjust the boost to whatever PSI you are comfortable with.

The main difference between all 4 tunes is features not power

[Steeve19M5CP]

ok stage 1 Burger BMS kit produces a fixed 664whp at 21psi (very quick install)

JB4 BMS makes map1 664whp (21psi), map2 676whp (23psi) and map3 694whp (25psi)on race fuel

What is the Racechip producing in dynojet whp power and which maps?

[onfireX5]

Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP

ok stage 1 Burger BMS kit produces a fixed 664whp at 21psi (very quick install)

JB4 BMS makes map1 664whp (21psi), map2 676whp (23psi) and map3 694whp (25psi)on race fuel

What is the Racechip producing in dynojet whp power and which maps?

I like Terry and have bought, tuned and used two JB’s.

RC on SP7 produces a solid 21 to 21.5 psi on my logs.

Strictly talking piggy boost, you will make the same rwhp static with Dinan, JB4, RC, etc,etc,etc IF THEY ARE ALL SET TO THE SAME ADDER. No magic in the HP number if the boost is the same amount and the unit is a piggy. There is some magic in other areas.

[Steeve19M5CP]

Originally Posted by onfireX5

I like Terry and have bought, tuned and used two JB’s.

RC on SP7 produces a solid 21 to 21.5 psi on my logs.

Strictly talking piggy boost, you will make the same rwhp static with Dinan, JB4, RC, etc,etc,etc IF THEY ARE ALL SET TO THE SAME ADDER. No magic in the HP number if the boost is the same amount and the unit is a piggy. There is some magic in other areas.

ok so sounds like the maximum map SP7 on RC will make around 664whp like BMS JB4 map1 or BMS stage 1......no one dyno'd RC yet? I would say these two setups should be safe on the F90 M5...

[r33_RGSport]

Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP

ok so sounds like the maximum map SP7 on RC will make around 664whp like BMS JB4 map1 or BMS stage 1......no one dyno'd RC yet? I would say these two setups should be safe on the F90 M5...

Here is the dyno from RaceChip.

[Steeve19M5CP]

Originally Posted by r33_RGSport

Here is the dyno from RaceChip.

Attachment 1973264

Anyone with Racechip planning to dyno the car?

racechip: 747ps = 737HP = 650whp (15% loss)
stock: 665ps = 656HP = 571whp (15% loss)

79whp increase