[urbo73]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

Was just commenting that you need DAP in order to have any steering intervention not that DAP gives you all of it. From the conversation in this thread I thought it did but evidently that is not that case if others are like you. My guess is that so few vehicles have DAP but not parking assistance so that may be why we have not run across it before.

Gotcha. Here in NE, from the M340is I looked at on dealer's lots when I got mine, it was actually quite common just to have DAP and no the parking assistance. You get the basic PDC and rear camera with DAP, so maybe dealers are building them that way, but it's only $700, so it's strange at this price to not include it in builds. Same as the $700 Adaptive M Suspension option. I would put premium, DAP, PAP, and Adaptive M Suspension on all builds, but I'm not running a dealership.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

No, that is not correct. The side collision uses the side radars and not the camera. I have had mine move over already when the vehicle beside me started drifting into my lane. The camera looks forward and doesn't see what is beside you.

I think the confusion is with what exactly is side collision avoidance as it is not described in the manual.

Your highlighted statement above is incorrect per manual for side collision mitigation, which uses both front camera for lane marking, and radar sensors for the space next to the car.

However, the manual does not clearly states if side collision mitigation is for BSD at rear(with radars at rear + side?), or ACC at front(with radar at front + side), or both.

As described in previous replies, side collision mitigation as defined in manual detects lane marker crossing to intervene steering, so front camera is really needed.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by urbo73

Gotcha. Here in NE, from the M340is I looked at on dealer's lots when I got mine, it was actually quite common just to have DAP and no the parking assistance. You get the basic PDC and rear camera with DAP, so maybe dealers are building them that way, but it's only $700, so it's strange at this price to not include it in builds. Same as the $700 Adaptive M Suspension option. I would put premium, DAP, PAP, and Adaptive M Suspension on all builds, but I'm not running a dealership.

Rear camera(3AG) is standard on my 330i, and so are LDW(ZN4) and front collision warning w/ city collision mitigation(ZN3).

There is also a $200 PDC option added.

The LDW and FCW on my 330i (no DAP/DAPP/PAP) should use the same front camera at windshield.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

I think the confusion is with what exactly is side collision avoidance as it is not described in the manual.

Your highlighted statement above is incorrect per manual for side collision mitigation, which uses both front camera for lane marking, and radar sensors for the space next to the car.

However, the manual does not clearly states if side collision mitigation is for BSD at rear(with radars at rear + side?), or ACC at front(with radar at front + side), or both.

As described in previous replies, side collision mitigation as defined in manual detects lane marker crossing to intervene steering, so front camera is really needed.

I am not confused at all, in fact what I posted was because of what was stated in the manual and is fairly common knowledge by those who are familiar with the various options/systems. The front camera is not used to detect the vehicles as you previously mentioned in your post regarding how the vehicles were detected and the cameras used. Anytime the vehicle uses steering the camera is involved.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

Anytime steering is involved (lane departure, side collision, blind spot) you need to have DAP since it needs the upper KAFAS camera.

That is incorrect, as G20 does come standard with Active Guard 5AV that includes LDW and FCW, and both needs windshield mounted KAFAS camera, there is no need for Driving Assistant Package to get LDW.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

That is incorrect, as G20 standard comes with LDW that does not require Driving Assistance Package nor Driving Assistance Pro Package.

The confusion is that G20 does come standard with Active Guard 5AV that includes LDW and FCW, and both needs windshield mounted(KAFAS?) camera.

Once again, I'm not the one that is confused. Please step back and review the different packages and options that are available and what they do. Concentrate on what LDW is and the different levels. LDW is standard but the acronym LDW stands for Lane Departure Warning, there is no steering involved. In order for it to have steering intervention you need to have the DAP package so you can get the Active Lane Keeping Assistant.

I know you are trying to save some face and deflect from your incorrect statements but now you are starting to look a bit silly.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

Once again, I'm not the one that is confused. Please step back and review the different packages and options that are available and what they do. Concentrate on what LDW is and the different levels. LDW is standard but the acronym LDW stands for Lane Departure Warning, there is no steering involved. In order for it to have steering intervention you need to have the DAP package so you can get the Active Lane Keeping Assistant.

I know you are trying to save some face and deflect from your incorrect statements but now you are starting to look a bit silly.

LDW on my G20 330i without Driving Assistance Package nor Driving Assistance Package does come with steering intervention, so it looks like you are confused.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

LDW on my G20 330i without Driving Assistance Package nor Driving Assistance Package does come with steering intervention, so it looks like you are confused.

If that is true then I am. I have never seen that mentioned by anyone or anywhere prior to you saying it. As far as what BMW publishes that is not correct. I will definitely look into that.

Edit: The tech docs, order guide , manual, BMW sites and third party reviewers all say you need to have DAP in order for lane keeping assist with steering. Hopefully others join in.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

LDW on my G20 330i without Driving Assistance Package nor Driving Assistance Package does come with steering intervention, so it looks like you are confused.

So either you are confused about what packages your vehicle has or you are trolling and seeing if I buy into your nonsense, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt.

You mentioned that you didn't ZDA (Driving Assistance Package) but that is how to get LDW in the 3 Series.



It is not standard as part of the Active Guard like you previously stated. Active Guard is FCW and City Collision Mitigation.




If everything operates like you say, then please explain what the Active Lane Keeping Assistant is? Hint: It is the steering portion of the Lane Departure system.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

The front camera is not used to detect the vehicles as you previously mentioned in your post regarding how the vehicles were detected and the cameras used. Anytime the vehicle uses steering the camera is involved.

Honestly since there is no description anywhere of side collision avoidance, so I can't tell what camera/sensor it is supposed to use.

And the front camera@grill has horizontal range of 190-degree of capture plus 100m of range, so it is capable of front side movement.

Now the only reference of side collision avoidance is with lane change assistant(not lane change warning), so without full description, I can only speculate as-in "I think"(in my previous post) that front camera@grill may be involved. :dunno:

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

So either you are confused about what packages your vehicle has or you are trolling and seeing if I buy into your nonsense, I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt.

You mentioned that you didn't ZDA (Driving Assistance Package) but that is how to get LDW in the 3 Series. ....

It is not standard as part of the Active Guard like you previously stated. Active Guard is FCW and City Collision Mitigation
....

If everything operates like you say, then please explain what the Active Lane Keeping Assistant is? Hint: It is the steering portion of the Lane Departure system.

All I can say is that G20 base 330i comes with 5AV Active Guard per order guide, and my base 330 has LDW with steering intervention, plus FCW(and both work)

I don't have front camera@grill, so the above is accomplished by KAFAS camera@windshield.

My window sticker has no DAP nor DAPP nor PAP, so I am 100% sure I didn't pay for those.

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

All I can say is that G20 base 330i comes with 5AV Active Guard per order guide, and my base 330 has LDW with steering intervention, plus FCW and City Collision Mitigation(and both work)

I don't have front camera@grill, so the above is accomplished by KAFAS camera@windshield.

My window sticker has no DAP nor DAPP nor PAP, so I am 100% sure I didn't pay for those.

You must have a one off car and got lucky and they put it in by mistake.

As an aside, the front camera @ the grill has nothing to do with any of the safety systems. That is only for parking and the surround view. Perhaps you are thinking of the front radar which comes with the DAP package.

Edit: I did find one reference to Lane Departure Warning being standard. It is listed in the IIHS ratings. It also mentions that the steering intervention is an option.



https://www.iihs.org/ratings/vehicle...oor-sedan/2021

They likely either tested a model with the package or made a mistake writing up the summary. As noted in Car and Driver, US News and others, the lane departure warning is not standard.



https://www.caranddriver.com/bmw/3-series



https://cars.usnews.com/cars-trucks/...s-sedan-415077

[urbo73]

What a confusing mess lol. Things were a lot simpler in my VW GTI - all included.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

You must have a one off car and got lucky and they put it in by mistake.

As an aside, the front camera @ the grill has nothing to do with any of the safety systems. That is only for parking and the surround view. Perhaps you are thinking of the front radar which comes with the DAP package.

Edit: I did find one reference to Lane Departure Warning being standard. It is listed in the IIHS ratings. It also mentions that the steering intervention is an option.

....

They likely either tested a model with the package or made a mistake writing up the summary. As noted in Car and Driver, US News and others, the lane departure warning is not standard.

I do wonder if BMW moves LDW+steering intervention from Driving assistance package to standard Active Guard in MY2021 to line up with Audi/MB/Honda/Tesla/etc-etc.

As far as front camera@grill, BMW says:

"The front camera enables an early view of crossing traffic at exits and junctions with a poor viewing angle. Road users concealed by objects on the sides are recognized relatively late from the driver's seat.....

The front camera installed between both of the radiator grilles. The images are shown in the display up to a speed of 30 km/h."

So it sounds like this is not just surround view/parking, but@30km/h it may be unlikely to participate in lane change assistant w/ side collision avoidance.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by urbo73

What a confusing mess lol. Things were a lot simpler in my VW GTI - all included.

Genius@dealer speculates BMW will have most driver techs as standard in G20 LCI.

[bavarianride]

FWIW, this is JDPower's take on Active Guard, Active Driving Assistant(in DAP), Active Driving Assistant Pro(in DAPP):

https://www.jdpower.com/cars/shoppin...ving-assistant

"Standard on lower-end BMWs such as the 3 Series and X3, Active Guard includes forward-collision warning, low-speed automatic emergency braking, and lane-departure warning."

[TurtleBoy]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

"The front camera enables an early view of crossing traffic at exits and junctions with a poor viewing angle. Road users concealed by objects on the sides are recognized relatively late from the driver's seat.....

The front camera installed between both of the radiator grilles. The images are shown in the display up to a speed of 30 km/h."

So it sounds like this is not just surround view/parking, but@30km/h it may be unlikely to participate in lane change assistant w/ side collision avoidance.

OMG Buddy, give it up. You have to purposely be misunderstanding the posts at this point. I'm done with you and your childishness. Good luck in getting someone else not play your games.

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by TurtleBoy

OMG Buddy, give it up. You have to purposely be misunderstanding the posts at this point. I'm done with you and your childishness. Good luck in getting someone else not play your games.

It is obvious that u are quite confused yourself, welcome to the club.

[urbo73]

Originally Posted by bavarianride

Genius@dealer speculates BMW will have most driver techs as standard in G20 LCI.

When is the LCI M340i coming? A year from now for a MY 2023?

[bavarianride]

Originally Posted by urbo73

When is the LCI M340i coming? A year from now for a MY 2023?

Model year(MY) 2023 is what the auto press speculates for G20 LCI, and typical LCI from previous gens is also 5th MY.

I think 330i and M340i LCIs should be released at the same.

https://www.autoevolution.com/news/2...es-162637.html