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      07-02-2017, 12:53 PM   #89
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Originally Posted by davey111483 View Post
is it fully automatic not DCT? why do they have paddle shifters?
Why are there paddles on a dct car when the car will shift for you automatically? Full auto and dct both offer automatic shifting, the paddles are optional use not required use.
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      07-02-2017, 07:11 PM   #90
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      07-02-2017, 07:21 PM   #91
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Originally Posted by kyrix1st View Post
I have to point out that fastest DCT in the market shifts in 6-8ms. Contact ZF (Porsche tranny supplier) for a more accurate info. DCT is consistent in downshifts at the limit where torque converter struggles after a while due to overheating. It might be just me, but I hate the half-clutch-all-the-time feel of auto tranny.
I'd like to see something official stating the Porsche PDK shifts in 6-8ms. I could not find anything supporting that claim. Supposedly the new 10-speed auto Chevy just put into the Camaro shifts faster than the Porsche so I find it hard to believe those times are accurate. And if the GM tranny can be as quick or quicker than a DCT, no reason the one BMW is using couldn't be too. All the keyboard warriors are out assuming the sky is falling. I'll wait until the car is out and I can experience it in person rather than just assuming it's garbage.
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      07-03-2017, 09:37 AM   #92
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When will somebody go full retard and just smash the windows in to get pics we want with no glare? LOL
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      07-03-2017, 11:06 AM   #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kyrix1st View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by JRobUSC View Post
My understanding is they got the shift times in the new M ZF down to 100ms. If so that's as fast as the best DCT's on the market, and better than any competitors (most of which are at 200ms).
I have to point out that fastest DCT in the market shifts in 6-8ms. Contact ZF (Porsche tranny supplier) for a more accurate info. DCT is consistent in downshifts at the limit where torque converter struggles after a while due to overheating. It might be just me, but I hate the half-clutch-all-the-time feel of auto tranny.
I thought I read that the torque converter locks like five feet or something after leaving a standstill.
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      07-03-2017, 02:21 PM   #94
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Added video with startup sound and peek at interior:

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      07-03-2017, 02:56 PM   #95
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRobUSC View Post
I'd like to see something official stating the Porsche PDK shifts in 6-8ms. I could not find anything supporting that claim. Supposedly the new 10-speed auto Chevy just put into the Camaro shifts faster than the Porsche so I find it hard to believe those times are accurate. And if the GM tranny can be as quick or quicker than a DCT, no reason the one BMW is using couldn't be too. All the keyboard warriors are out assuming the sky is falling. I'll wait until the car is out and I can experience it in person rather than just assuming it's garbage.
https://www.google.com/patents/US6634247

No wonder you can't, it's generally classified information. This is from US patent registered in 2003.

Download the PDF and you will notice that they don't specify on the published paper but instead say "FIGS. 14 through 18 torque curves of embodiments in accordance with the invention on the shifting time between two gears,"

Other than the patent one, about a decade ago Volkswagen AG published an article on DSG but it never specified shift time. I believe they suggested an "average shift time under full throttle" to be 8ms in DSG transmissions, you can google "dsg 8ms" and it will give you bunch of old articles.

ZF8HP on the other hand is known to have 200ms~250ms as default setting, although it is known to take half the time thanks to optimization of shifting programs (by individual makers such as BMW, Audi), bringing down to about 100ms. Haven't got the info on 8 speed DCT from ZF since it is new.

http://papers.sae.org/2012-01-0060/

I haven't got an access to this article yet since I am at home, but I will also post what I can find. I believe it could contain actual values in this paper.
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Last edited by kyrix1st; 07-03-2017 at 03:09 PM..
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      07-03-2017, 03:05 PM   #96
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Originally Posted by JRobUSC View Post
d auto Chevy just put into the Camaro shifts faster than the Porsche so I find it hard to believe those times are accurate. And if the GM tranny can be as quick or quicker than a DCT, no reason the one BMW is using couldn't be too.
BMW already mentioned it wouldn't use American transmissions for its shift quality(shift time and smoothness) albeit its high torque limit advantage. Why would they cross the Ocean deliberately when they have excellent makers such as Getrag and ZF already in Europe?
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      07-03-2017, 06:08 PM   #97
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it's so damn quiet stock :
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      07-03-2017, 08:57 PM   #98
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Originally Posted by PetrolFumes View Post
it's so damn quiet stock :
Are you sure that the 6-8 ms shift time of the Porsche DCT is not the time it takes to change the gear ratio only? IE, it's not taking into account the time it takes to disengage, then reengage the clutch?
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      07-03-2017, 09:09 PM   #99
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bmw needs to fire their interior designer and they need to do it fast oh god have bmw got such boring interiors.. i would rather they go back to the airplane looking e38 style interiors then this new junk they got now i mean look at the new 5 series cluster looks like it came straight out of the hyundai disgusting
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      07-03-2017, 10:16 PM   #100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bowser330 View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by davey111483 View Post
is it fully automatic not DCT? why do they have paddle shifters?
Why are there paddles on a dct car when the car will shift for you automatically? Full auto and dct both offer automatic shifting, the paddles are optional use not required use.

In three years, BMW will announce " no one uses the flappy paddles anymore because our 11 speed automatic is so good " and they won't include them on cars anymore , saving another $X per vehicle in manufacturing costs .

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      07-03-2017, 10:26 PM   #101
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I've noticed the seats have a black strip going down the center. Also the lumbar support slightly indented in the center. Can't wait to get this thing. However the exhaust note as this thing is driving is almost non existent. But then again we are getting the exhaust button so mayb there is still good to come
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      07-03-2017, 10:29 PM   #102
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthColin
Quote:
Originally Posted by PetrolFumes View Post
it's so damn quiet stock :
Are you sure that the 6-8 ms shift time of the Porsche DCT is not the time it takes to change the gear ratio only? IE, it's not taking into account the time it takes to disengage, them reengage the clutch?
what does this have to do with the sound of the exhaust?
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      07-03-2017, 10:37 PM   #103
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Is this really the kind of interior people want these days? Super fussy with all kinds of hideous glossy material everywhere and WTF is going on with the gear selector??
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      07-03-2017, 11:19 PM   #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AKRAPOVICOWNS View Post
Maybe this isn't the final one. This is just the same used in the M550..doubt they would put the same one in the M5.
The F10 M5 used the same base steering wheel as any other 5 series for a while. Expect to pay extra for the fancy M-wheel.


Also, considering this is an automatic only car, I'm I the only one who think putting a fake gear lever is a waste of console space ? I means it does not have any mechanical linkage, it would be a massive advantage to just replace it by a button or a stalk ? You'd get twice the amount of storage space.
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      07-04-2017, 12:04 AM   #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dsocold View Post
bmw needs to fire their interior designer and they need to do it fast oh god have bmw got such boring interiors.. i would rather they go back to the airplane looking e38 style interiors then this new junk they got now i mean look at the new 5 series cluster looks like it came straight out of the hyundai disgusting
While I agree some spark in design is required, the new Hyundai interiors are quite nice actually. I suggest you find someone else to beat pick one.
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      07-04-2017, 01:49 AM   #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PetrolFumes View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthColin
Quote:
Originally Posted by PetrolFumes View Post
it's so damn quiet stock :
Are you sure that the 6-8 ms shift time of the Porsche DCT is not the time it takes to change the gear ratio only? IE, it's not taking into account the time it takes to disengage, them reengage the clutch?
what does this have to do with the sound of the exhaust?
Nothing by the looks of it. Don't know how to use quote button.
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      07-04-2017, 03:42 AM   #107
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JRobUSC View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by kyrix1st View Post
I have to point out that fastest DCT in the market shifts in 6-8ms. Contact ZF (Porsche tranny supplier) for a more accurate info. DCT is consistent in downshifts at the limit where torque converter struggles after a while due to overheating. It might be just me, but I hate the half-clutch-all-the-time feel of auto tranny.
I'd like to see something official stating the Porsche PDK shifts in 6-8ms. I could not find anything supporting that claim. Supposedly the new 10-speed auto Chevy just put into the Camaro shifts faster than the Porsche so I find it hard to believe those times are accurate. And if the GM tranny can be as quick or quicker than a DCT, no reason the one BMW is using couldn't be too. All the keyboard warriors are out assuming the sky is falling. I'll wait until the car is out and I can experience it in person rather than just assuming it's garbage.
Yeah that's what I haven saying, wait till the car comes out and drive it first before deciding.

Next year by this time people will be like "DCT? garbage"!
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      07-04-2017, 03:42 AM   #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by davey111483 View Post
is it fully automatic not DCT? why do they have paddle shifters?
Auto bmws have had paddle shifters for almost a decade now.
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      07-04-2017, 05:06 AM   #109
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthColin View Post
Are you sure that the 6-8 ms shift time of the Porsche DCT is not the time it takes to change the gear ratio only? IE, it's not taking into account the time it takes to disengage, then reengage the clutch?
Could be, but since the number is compared with other DCT equivalents, they are likely measuring time of o the identical mechanical process. Getrag isn't the fastest shifting DCT I've seen; I imagine it is due to some reliability compromise that comes with higher shifting speed.
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      07-04-2017, 08:44 AM   #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PetrolFumes View Post
it's so damn quiet stock :
I was thinking the exact same thing - I had to rewind the video to see if I had issued the "startup sound"
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