[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by 6ixSpd

So basically the intangibles that make for a good M car, this boat lacks. As expected.

Next.

The F90 M5 is probably in a word, too "good" but also too "indistinctive."

They essentially improved upon everything that could be improved upon, performance wise, from the F10 M5. You ask any long time F10 M5 owner, the number one complaint was always, no traction. They fixed that in the F90. All small improvements, like carbon fiber roof, while ignoring things that also matter, like steering feel.

They've taken the BMW M5 in a direction which caters to the masses and not the few. The F90 M5 is pretty much great at everything now, its got traction, clutch engages smoothly when lumbering around in the grocery store parking lot, a bit more aggressive styling with carbon roof and stock finned diffuser, iDrive system has never been better, engine is strong and reliable with a bit better exhaust note. On the track, it'll murder apex's with the M xDrive, on the drag strip you can finally beat that modded Jeep SRT with its AWD, at the stoplight you can easily defeat that 19 year old kid with his modded WRX, and on the highway not many factory power output cars will outrun you. The new F90 has pretty much no flaws now. It is in fact the best M5 ever.

What the F90 M5 truly lacks is a certain jais ne se quois from both F10 M5 and the E63S AMG. It's just not different enough from both of those cars to really make it "special." It's basically a different cake made with the same recipe.

It's not M's fault though, these super saloons are just simply becoming less relevant as these businesses seek only to improve their bottom line and stave off perceived market shifts to the next electric sedan that will do 0-60 in 2.2 seconds.

But I tell you, if M had made this new M5 with an NA V12 mated to a DCT or an optional 6MT with AWD, a chassis weight of 4,300lbs, and making 700hp, I wouldn't be writing this post right now.

[BMW M Power Mexico]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

The F90 M5 is probably in a word, too "good" but also too "indistinctive."

They essentially improved upon everything that could be improved upon, performance wise, from the F10 M5. You ask any long time F10 M5 owner, the number one complaint was always, no traction. They fixed that in the F90. All small improvements, like carbon fiber roof, while ignoring things that also matter, like steering feel.

They've taken the BMW M5 in a direction which caters to the masses and not the few. The F90 M5 is pretty much great at everything now, its got traction, clutch engages smoothly when lumbering around in the grocery store parking lot, a bit more aggressive styling with carbon roof and stock finned diffuser, iDrive system has never been better, engine is strong and reliable with a bit better exhaust note. On the track, it'll murder apex's with the M xDrive, on the drag strip you can finally beat that modded Jeep SRT with its AWD, at the stoplight you can easily defeat that 19 year old kid with his modded WRX, and on the highway not many factory power output cars will outrun you. The new F90 has pretty much no flaws now. It is in fact the best M5 ever.

What the F90 M5 truly lacks is a certain jais ne se quois from both F10 M5 and the E63S AMG. It's just not different enough from both of those cars to really make it "special." It's basically a different cake made with the same recipe.

It's not M's fault though, these super saloons are just simply becoming less relevant as these businesses seek only to improve their bottom line and stave off perceived market shifts to the next electric sedan that will do 0-60 in 2.2 seconds.

But I tell you, if M had made this new M5 with an NA V12 mated to a DCT or an optional 6MT with AWD, a chassis weight of 4,300lbs, and making 700hp, I wouldn't be writing this post right now.

I see zero "jais ne se quois" factor favouring the F10 over the F90.

If you were talking any of the previous M5s with truly bespoke N/A engines you would have a point. But the F90 is better than the F10 in every possible way IMO.

[KevinM]

I thought the Carfection and CarWow videos were well done. I was a fan of the guy who did the Carfection video while he was at evo - I'm glad he's still doing automotive journalism.

[kyrix1st]

Originally Posted by GioM3

It looks like you've got too much time on your hands mate, to type all this info for us, thanks for that, but deal breaker was the last bit, slightly modified e36 is better than e92?????
How about 7.27 around Nurburgring in e92 M3, I didn't see e36 beat that....

You mean 7:27 of M4 GTS.

Even E92 M3 GTS never ran close to that time let alone beat E46 M3 CSL’s 7:50.
If you look at the sector times of stock E36, E46 (identical Nordschleife lap time) and E92s, the difference is mostly in the back straight not in corners. Circuits in JP are mostly tight hairpins with one short straight line, which is why lightweight cars like rx7 have very strong track records. It would be a different story in Silverstone. For Euro cup races (BMW challenge) held in JP, E36 is always the fastest competing with E46 and E92 (all on stock engine, no supercharging)

Don’t get me wrong though. If stripped down to the same weight, E92 will always beat the crap out of previous generations.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

It seems to beat the E63 AMG S to 60 and in the quarter mile.

[kyrix1st]

Originally Posted by RPiM5

The F90 M5 is probably in a word, too "good" but also too "indistinctive."

I personally believe it would have been much better received if the car launched with DCT. Still distinctive in its segment, with that crisp shifts that no slush box could imitate.

[The Automotive Enthusiast]

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by BMW M Power Mexico

I see zero "jais ne se quois" factor favouring the F10 over the F90.

If you were talking any of the previous M5s with truly bespoke N/A engines you would have a point. But the F90 is better than the F10 in every possible way IMO.

Then you never owned an F10 M5 long enough to desire a new engine design in a new generation of car. The S63 is a great engine but variety is the spice of life.

[Axman85]

Performance might be bad ass but it just looks like crap. Can't get into its style. Doesn't look aggressive like past M5's. Seems like it wants to be that elder statesman.

[evanescent03]

Originally Posted by Axman85

Performance might be bad ass but it just looks like crap. Can't get into its style. Doesn't look aggressive like past M5's. Seems like it wants to be that elder statesman.

I think every M5 has been a little subdued and you can only identify them by the exhaust and side M fender grille... I think sleeper highway king has been their play for the past couple generations and I think they're on track.

[GioM3]

Originally Posted by kyrix1st

You mean 7:27 of M4 GTS.

Even E92 M3 GTS never ran close to that time let alone beat E46 M3 CSL’s 7:50.
If you look at the sector times of stock E36, E46 (identical Nordschleife lap time) and E92s, the difference is mostly in the back straight not in corners. Circuits in JP are mostly tight hairpins with one short straight line, which is why lightweight cars like rx7 have very strong track records. It would be a different story in Silverstone. For Euro cup races (BMW challenge) held in JP, E36 is always the fastest competing with E46 and E92 (all on stock engine, no supercharging)

Don’t get me wrong though. If stripped down to the same weight, E92 will always beat the crap out of previous generations.

I wasn't talking about GTS, if you go on to YouTube, there's plenty of lightly modified (non Supercharged) e92 M3s lapping crazy Times, in my opinion e36 M3 was good, but not as good balanced car as e34 M5 or e46 M3, I think e92 M3 is last pure, old school M car, N/A engine, MT, well balanced chassis, everyday usability as well as track day machine, it only needs aftermarket Exaust, K&N air-filter, and Performance pads. Don't need to change anything else.

[JMD]

Looks like "Donington Grey" is the best color for the lines of the new M5 - IMHO!

[bm323]

"A high point is the steering. The electric power assistance is nicely judged, full of feel and with a nice linear, faithful response, regardless of which of the three selectable steering weights you’ve selected. And the weightiest Sport Plus setting isn’t as needlessly heavy or sharp as some performance cars...

On the Estoril circuit, in six quick-ish laps behind a pace car, it felt very adjustable on- and off-throttle, with predictable, reassuring handling but plenty of potential to go very sideways if that’s your thing, even in 4WD mode. You’re always aware of the car’s bulk but it controls its mass well."

http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/car-rev...5-2018-review/

[Gmoney El Nene]

3.1 seconds & 11.1 in the quarter mile....sick.

[DocWeatherington]

Shmee150 drives the MotoGP M5 Safety Car!

Note the Performance Exhaust at 15:00-17:00, i wonder which exhaust version this is.

[RPiM5]

Originally Posted by 6ixSpd

So basically the intangibles that make for a good M car, this boat lacks. As expected.

Next.

I found the intangibles you spoke of.

[PDOT]

Originally Posted by DocWeatherington

Shmee150 drives the MotoGP M5 Safety Car!

Note the Performance Exhaust at 15:00-17:00, i wonder which exhaust version this is.

You don't have to park the car to switch from 2WD to 4WD do you?

[DocWeatherington]

Originally Posted by PDOT

You don't have to park the car to switch from 2WD to 4WD do you?

From what I've seen no, but don't have one to confirm.

[Soul_Glo]

2018 BMW M5 First Drive in Portugal: Welcome to the 600-HP Club - The Drive

https://apple.news/AZS1FZcYUR3eBFQ2TzjAdng

[cgg126]

So, am I the only one who thinks the E63 S is like 5 years ahead of this car in almost every way???

[BG23]

Originally Posted by cgg126

So, am I the only one who thinks the E63 S is like 5 years ahead of this car in almost every way???

First time poster. Currently own an F10 M5 and decided after some significant research (and seat time in the E63s) to order the new F90.

I must admit I am surprised by your comment. I like both cars and would be happy with either. However objectively the only superior aspect to the E63s was sound.

Every other aspect went to the M5 - would you mind being more specific?

[bm323]

https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews...t-drive-review

"We muttered a few profanities the first time we read those details about the drivetrain. Then we actually drove the 2018 BMW M5, and hallelujahs spilled from our lips. You’ll saw at the steering wheel as you balance the M5 at its cornering limits and the rear end wriggles under hard straight-line braking. Trail-brake it toward the apex, balance the car on the throttle, tighten your line by lifting. This is engaged driving. And fun. Those attributes were largely absent from the stoic F10-generation M5. While it’s not a return to full form, the new M5 is a solid step toward redeeming that last-generation car, which placed third out of three in its only comparison-test appearance....

The 2018 BMW M5’s born-again chassis dynamics suggest that the M division is turning back toward its faith in driver engagement. But M is, after all, a subordinate organization of the bigger enterprise, and, as such, the division’s complete redemption is only possible if the larger BMW brand can find the same religion and infuse it into the core products."

http://www.carmag.co.za/news_post/to...des-amg-e63-s/

"5. Kerb weight:

In the world of fast cars, weight always plays a crucial role. Mercedes-AMG claims that its E63 S tips the scales at 1 955 kg, while BMW says the new M5 comes in at 1 855 kg, sans driver. And that weight difference allows the M5 to match the E63 S in the 0-100 km/h sprint (well, on paper, anyway), despite being down on both power and torque."