[GhostyM]

Since 2020/2021 models have some new ECU's that aren't cracked yet, it seems I have to piggyback a tune like JB4 instead anyways (not going to bench flash). Does JB4 get flagged using their new flagging methods (such as flash tunes getting noticed at service intervals)?

[Higgs Boson]

The piggyback itself would not be flagged by the computer system but could be flagged visually by a technician if you left it on.

The issue is at the time of failure, if something happens and you then remove the piggyback then it won't matter. BMW can see engine parameters up to and at the point of failure, which means if you're running a piggyback, the parameters won't be within stock ranges and they will know.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Its a lot harder to be caught with a piggy than flash

with that being said in 99.99% of the case you are safe with either one

[Narco1]

Originally Posted by GhostyM

Since 2020/2021 models have some new ECU's that aren't cracked yet, it seems I have to piggyback a tune like JB4 instead anyways (not going to bench flash). Does JB4 get flagged using their new flagging methods (such as flash tunes getting noticed at service intervals)?

Real simple if you’re worried about this then don’t tune the car. You’ll sleep better.

Any tune can be discovered if the dealer/manufacturer wants to look into it. Any major issue with the transmission/engine most likely will be looked into and the warranty will most likely be voided if they find a tune.

Do you think manufacturers have people monitoring these forums? Answer: yes.

Have a friend that is a shop Forman for a Porsche dealership. Says it takes minutes to find out if any kind of tune was used if they want to.

[GhostyM]

I'm not worried about the tune per se, just the fact that I think I can't tune my car with a flash tune. Don't want to "bench" tune. Don't wanna buy one and then realize it won't work hence why I asked if JB4's will work.

Sort of dual ended question as I was curious. I've ran JB4 for years on my other cars.

[r33_RGSport]

If you are doing JB4, don't use the EWG connectors.
With those plugged in, you are adding more data that is being altered which will shows in the DME logs.

Without those plugged in, it is pretty much acting like BMS Stage 1 or RaceChip GTS Black.

Just a simple 2 boost sensors that need to be tapped into.

[DannyA]

You are defo "safer" with the piggy, as the BMW techs will need to suspect something, then perform some analytics on the engine data to then refuse the warranty work. With a remap, they can see instantly it has been altered.

[Maverik259]

I've heard their new set up can detect if the turbos have simply been run outside their operating parameters and it'll flag. But not sure myself. But if true then I would suspect both can be detected. 😕

[TrevorM3]

it's very simple, if you blow a motor BMW will bring out a regional tech to look at the car. At that point, you're done.

So the question should be, "if i tune, what are my chances my engine blows" becuase if it does, get your checkbook out.

[GranitM5]

Originally Posted by TrevorM3

it's very simple, if you blow a motor BMW will bring out a regional tech to look at the car. At that point, you're done.

So the question should be, "if i tune, what are my chances my engine blows" becuase if it does, get your checkbook out.

Unless you can make your car disappear...then insurance deals with it and you get a brand new car lol. Yes they do steal cars in NY lol

[LongBeachDinanFan]

A good piggyback is a lot more difficult to detect. The new BMW software now auto detects and auto flags flashed cars even if the dealership or service advisor is "cool" so the gig is sort of up on that front. It's like Audi now unfortunately.

[BMWDriverX]

A lot of misinformation all up in here. Yes BMW will now know if you have a flash tune or ever flash tuned even if you bring it in for an oil change with their new auto detect software, like Audi. If you run a piggyback and it is not in the car it's your word against theirs and a multi billion dollar company is not going to fight with a customer unless they have concrete evidence. Just the facts of life.

[TrevorM3]

Originally Posted by BMWDriverX

A lot of misinformation all up in here. Yes BMW will now know if you have a flash tune or ever flash tuned even if you bring it in for an oil change with their new auto detect software, like Audi. If you run a piggyback and it is not in the car it's your word against theirs and a multi billion dollar company is not going to fight with a customer unless they have concrete evidence. Just the facts of life.

what?

You think if you blow a motor BMW's gonna just shell out 50k for a new one w/o first investigating? Things aren't like that anymore, like 3-4 years ago. It seems YOU are misinformed, or i should say flash tuned...

[BMWDriverX]

Originally Posted by TrevorM3

what?

You think if you blow a motor BMW's gonna just shell out 50k for a new one w/o first investigating? Things aren't like that anymore, like 3-4 years ago. It seems YOU are misinformed, or i should say flash tuned...

I think lay off the sauce dude, i don't know what you're saying. We're talking piggies here not flashes, my M6 was flashed, my M5 is not cause i kept my ear to the street and knew this auto detect crap was coming over a year ago. To answer your question, yes they will shell out $50k because motors blow bro, it happens tuned or not, mods or stock so they investigate but if the car was never flash tuned there's not much they can come up with. Piggies don't leave a signature once removed, it's called an interceptor for a reason if you do some research.

[josec70]

Originally Posted by BMWDriverX

I think lay off the sauce dude, i don't know what you're saying. We're talking piggies here not flashes, my M6 was flashed, my M5 is not cause i kept my ear to the street and knew this auto detect crap was coming over a year ago. To answer your question, yes they will shell out $50k because motors blow bro, it happens tuned or not, mods or stock so they investigate but if the car was never flash tuned there's not much they can come up with. Piggies don't leave a signature once removed, it's called an interceptor for a reason if you do some research.

BMW will deny coverage if you run a piggy and blow an engine... while they can't physically detect the piggy (if removed) they can read all data that is recorded on your ECU and will easily see boost parameters well outside the factory limits.

This is not speculation but factual as I have seen it firsthand. A buddy of mine bent a rod on an F10 M5, removed the piggy and was denied warranty coverage for this very reason. ... BMW regional rep came out and that was that .. you're not winning this battle against BMW.

With that said, I ran piggys for almost 6 years on two F10 M5's with zero issues .... kept my current F90 stock to avoid the entire headache.

[BMWDriverX]

Originally Posted by josec70

BMW will deny coverage if you run a piggy and blow an engine... while they can't physically detect the piggy (if removed) they can read all data that is recorded on your ECU and will easily see boost parameters well outside the factory limits.

This is not speculation but factual as I have seen it firsthand. A buddy of mine bent a rod on an F10 M5, removed the piggy and was denied warranty coverage for this very reason. ... BMW regional rep came out and that was that .. you're not winning this battle against BMW.

With that said, I ran piggys for almost 6 years on two F10 M5's with zero issues .... kept my current F90 stock to avoid the entire headache.

I am sure it's all based on every different scenario but just like you have stories, so do i and they go against everything you just said. I am not going to spell it out on the forum, but if it's not there it's just not there. Boost can jump at peaks without a tune in different temperatures, it is not absolute at the stock levels so no BMW cannot say oh you produced more boost and use that as an excuse, also the the DME's don't see what boost levels you get from a piggy, the DME sees the stock levels because again it is called an interceptor for a reason, look it up and research exactly how a piggyback works. I am not promoting anything, just speaking from experience and my car is 100% stock for the record

[josec70]

Originally Posted by BMWDriverX

I am sure it's all based on every different scenario but just like you have stories, so do i and they go against everything you just said. I am not going to spell it out on the forum, but if it's not there it's just not there. Boost can jump at peaks without a tune in different temperatures, it is not absolute at the stock levels so no BMW cannot say oh you produced more boost and use that as an excuse, also the the DME's don't see what boost levels you get from a piggy, the DME sees the stock levels because again it is called an interceptor for a reason, look it up and research exactly how a piggyback works. I am not promoting anything, just speaking from experience and my car is 100% stock for the record

Respect your opinion and I'm 💯 clear on how a piggy intercepts a signal essentially creating a new one to trick the car into creating more boost ... no need to research this.

While we may disagree on whether it can be detected or not, what BMW will do is not a slam dunk and that is a risk .. I've seen them act like dicks and you say they won't.

Owners can do whatever they want; I'm just putting on the table the real possibility that they deny coverage and a misinformed owner is stuck with a bill.

I have enough headaches in my life to deal with another one, especially this year LOL!!!

Stay safe brother!!

[BMWDriverX]

Originally Posted by josec70

Respect your opinion and I'm 💯 clear on how a piggy intercepts a signal essentially creating a new one to trick the car into creating more boost ... no need to research this.

While we may disagree on whether it can be detected or not, what BMW will do is not a slam dunk and that is a risk .. I've seen them act like dicks and you say they won't.

Owners can do whatever they want; I'm just putting on the table the real possibility that they deny coverage and a misinformed owner is stuck with a bill.

I have enough headaches in my life to deal with another one, especially this year LOL!!!

Stay safe brother!!

You stay safe as well brother! On a side note i love this car so much more than the previous gens, I had the F06 M6 and just spun tires off the line and would lose to almost anything new out there from a light to light. Just this morning a Lambo Urus pulled up behind me all angry like they look and we lined up at a light, i blew the doors off that thing all the way to 100 or so and let off. The stunned look on the driver and passenger in my rear view mirror at the next light was ever so satisfying Of course I would rather have the Urus cause Lambo, but damn the new BMW all wheel drive models are just monsters on the street

[GhostyM]

Originally Posted by BMWDriverX

You stay safe as well brother! On a side note i love this car so much more than the previous gens, I had the F06 M6 and just spun tires off the line and would lose to almost anything new out there from a light to light. Just this morning a Lambo Urus pulled up behind me all angry like they look and we lined up at a light, i blew the doors off that thing all the way to 100 or so and let off. The stunned look on the driver and passenger in my rear view mirror at the next light was ever so satisfying Of course I would rather have the Urus cause Lambo, but damn the new BMW all wheel drive models are just monsters on the street

As a guy who has a Huracan EVO..



It really does crazy justice to the F9x platform (M8 comp here) that it's within spitting distance 60-130mph stock while weighing so much more. A piggyback and I can tell it'll pull harder through 3rd than my EVO. The EVO has insane pickup and go, but it does fall flat (although it's still super fast) around 3-4th gear (where power figures matter more than power/weight).

Amazing platform honestly.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by BMWDriverX

A lot of misinformation all up in here. Yes BMW will now know if you have a flash tune or ever flash tuned even if you bring it in for an oil change with their new auto detect software, like Audi. If you run a piggyback and it is not in the car it's your word against theirs and a multi billion dollar company is not going to fight with a customer unless they have concrete evidence. Just the facts of life.

I have a leased M4, fully built. Got my oil changed 2 weeks ago without any problem.

Unless you are bringing your car for warranty work, the dealership does not care.

[SickGTR]

Fellas, you tune you car and blow the motor or tranny YOU ARE FUCKED. They can read almost everything the car has done. It's not just boost pressure, even though that's one of the first things they see. Yeah, boost peaks at diff temps and situations but not up to what the tune will be at. I posted awhile back in the M4 section about this. I blew mt GTR tranny and brought it to the dealer. They gave my the info on the black box and I was Floored how much info was on it. Torque peeks, engine and tranny high temps. Top speed and RPM. This was 9 years ago, LOL. So if you think Nissan knows all that in 2011, BMW will know whats up and they will give you a big DICK, not a new engine. Tune at you own risk. Believe what you want. Just be ready to pay up if it happens

[BMWDriverX]

Originally Posted by SickGTR

Fellas, you tune you car and blow the motor or tranny YOU ARE FUCKED. They can read almost everything the car has done. It's not just boost pressure, even though that's one of the first things they see. Yeah, boost peaks at diff temps and situations but not up to what the tune will be at. I posted awhile back in the M4 section about this. I blew mt GTR tranny and brought it to the dealer. They gave my the info on the black box and I was Floored how much info was on it. Torque peeks, engine and tranny high temps. Top speed and RPM. This was 9 years ago, LOL. So if you think Nissan knows all that in 2011, BMW will know whats up and they will give you a big DICK, not a new engine. Tune at you own risk. Believe what you want. Just be ready to pay up if it happens

I agree you should be ready to pay up if you tune and something happens but what you outlined means they can deny warranty for flooring your car. There's a reason why i drive a BMW and not a Nissan. IMO BMW is out to help their customers because they want them back, Nissan knows that after you get into a GTR you run away to BMW or Porsche so they want to squeeze every penny they can out of their customers before they run away, it's not like you're going to go from a GTR to a Maxima, they only have one real performance model. Unless you are completely obvious with how you have modified your car, like heavy engine mods and your engine blows sure you're going to pay but even then BMW NA will help you with costs and cover some, Nissan will feed you a dick sandwich. I have been with BMW since 2007 with the 335 when it came out and i have been part of the community since then and i can tell you from many experiences that BMW works a lot better with their customers than a lot of other car brands.