M5 CS - A Supercar In Disguise - Catchpole on Carfection

WickedBMW · 01-12-2022, 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TexasSurgeon

Quote:

Originally Posted by PunjabiM3

Quote:

Originally Posted by TrevorM3

I can easily see who has never driven or owned a supercar...

Do you own some or are they your dad's? I have a few at home and the CS is probably the fastest car out of my three in 0-60 and the 1/4 mile. Also has the best sound system of the three and nicest interior. All around a superb car the M5 CS is without a doubt. But for emotional and special experience, my Speciale and gated R8 twin turbo are an entirely different league. But it doesn't make the M5 CS any less special as I think it is the best sedan in the world right now and can put a lot of supercars and sports cars to shame on a back road with the right driver. I bet the average person would be faster on a back road in the CS than a lot of supercars.

Hahhaa.

Every comment by TrevorM3 starts with "my Dads….."

I was wondering the same.

AHall · 01-12-2022, 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSurfer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSurfer

The title of the video is "super car in disguise". Meaning it has the performance and guts of a super car but dressed with too many doors and the engine in the wrong place.

I like to use the lay or the non "car guy" person as my definer of super cars. If they see it and say it's a super car than it ls a super car. They don't ruin it with stats, performance numbers or similar arguments noted in this thread. Car guys ruin cars. Never will any of the non car people call out a 4 door car as a super car. And that's a good thing. Because they should stand out. A super car should be super eye catchy, super fast, super expensive and most importantly super sexy. all that is what makes them a super car. They should stand out in every way and never blend into the crowd. You buy this M5 because you want an awesome, fast and practical car and it's a nice humble brag. You buy a super car because of the exclusivity, rarity and to let everyone know you made it.

Interesting that you didn't mention anything about the driving experience in your last sentence. I think that's the primary reason why people buy supercars.

If people bought super cars solely for driving experience, which is subjective I guess, most of the sales of those vehicles would be far lower than they are. I haven't driven many but I know Lamborghinis for a fact and as my example are insanity. The entire car is a blind spot, visibility is non existent, the cars are so low that you have to adjust your route based on the roads conditions. parking lots, parking garages and driveways? Forget about it unless you researched the spot prior. You can't even back a Lamborghini up without opening the door and sitting on the door sill or having someone guide you. All of that to me adds up to "driving experience". My M3 blows all of that out of the water. I can see everything, I can drive it on any public street and park it anywhere I want, plus the performance is more than enough for any public streets. Lamborghini on a track or an open road is probably a different story.

That being said, if money were no option, I would definitely throw a few super cars into the mix but not for the amazing "driving experience", I'm a car guy who likes beautiful cars and if I was on an island alone I'd still want one just for myself.

I never said solely for the driving experience, but rather it being a primary reason. There are people who buy these things for the experience rather than the image. In fact, the image/attention aspect may be more of a deterrent for some.

Comparing the practicality of a BMW with a Lambo is missing the point. Supercars should prioritize emotion over convenience or ease of use. My Countach offers near zero rearward visibility, has no power steering, a ridiculously stiff clutch, a useless A/C and takes 20 minutes to warm up before it changes gears smoothly (I use that term very loosely).

It's a big go kart with a bellowing V12 behind your head. I look forward to every drive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSurfer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSurfer

The title of the video is "super car in disguise". Meaning it has the performance and guts of a super car but dressed with too many doors and the engine in the wrong place.

I like to use the lay or the non "car guy" person as my definer of super cars. If they see it and say it's a super car than it ls a super car. They don't ruin it with stats, performance numbers or similar arguments noted in this thread. Car guys ruin cars. Never will any of the non car people call out a 4 door car as a super car. And that's a good thing. Because they should stand out. A super car should be super eye catchy, super fast, super expensive and most importantly super sexy. all that is what makes them a super car. They should stand out in every way and never blend into the crowd. You buy this M5 because you want an awesome, fast and practical car and it's a nice humble brag. You buy a super car because of the exclusivity, rarity and to let everyone know you made it.

Interesting that you didn't mention anything about the driving experience in your last sentence. I think that's the primary reason why people buy supercars.

If people bought super cars solely for driving experience, which is subjective I guess, most of the sales of those vehicles would be far lower than they are. I haven't driven many but I know Lamborghinis for a fact and as my example are insanity. The entire car is a blind spot, visibility is non existent, the cars are so low that you have to adjust your route based on the roads conditions. parking lots, parking garages and driveways? Forget about it unless you researched the spot prior. You can't even back a Lamborghini up without opening the door and sitting on the door sill or having someone guide you. All of that to me adds up to "driving experience". My M3 blows all of that out of the water. I can see everything, I can drive it on any public street and park it anywhere I want, plus the performance is more than enough for any public streets. Lamborghini on a track or an open road is probably a different story.

That being said, if money were no option, I would definitely throw a few super cars into the mix but not for the amazing "driving experience", I'm a car guy who likes beautiful cars and if I was on an island alone I'd still want one just for myself.

I never said solely for the driving experience, but rather it being a primary reason. There are people who buy these things for the experience rather than the image. In fact, the image/attention aspect may be more of a deterrent for some.

Comparing the practicality of a BMW with a Lambo is missing the point. Supercars should prioritize emotion over convenience or ease of use. My Countach offers near zero rearward visibility, has no power steering, a ridiculously stiff clutch, a useless A/C and takes 20 minutes to warm up before it changes gears smoothly (I use that term very loosely).

It's a big go kart with a bellowing V12 behind your head. I look forward to every drive.

So is the Countach considered a supercar today? Serious question. Is this something that changes? It does still have the wow factor to some and exclusivity, but not the supercar performance of today's high performance cars.

RwdJesus · 01-12-2022, 08:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crypto

Oh boy this thread is starting to attract some hate. It's like a reverse circle jerk. Not sure if there's a name for that. Outward triangle jerk? 🙄

No. Haven't you heard?

Its shit because it isnt a $600,000 Ferrari. Get with it. Thats the new party line

stefan · 01-12-2022, 08:34 AM

One of the reasons this car has completely hit the top of my list is the fact that it sorta makes me feel the way BMW used to where they are competing with exotic manufacturers. Remember that euro E36 ad comparing the hp per litre to Ferrari? This car feels like that. BMW punching way above its weight and dominating like it used to generations ago.

In person this car has an amazing presence. In true M5 fashion it is clearly special to those in the know but relatively stealthy otherwise. My E39 left a huge impression on me. Probably shouldn't have sold.

I'd happily buy an M5CS over any of its equally priced competitors without hesitation. There is nothing else at this price range that I can logically see myself driving every day.

Chicane_ · 01-12-2022, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSurfer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSurfer

The title of the video is "super car in disguise". Meaning it has the performance and guts of a super car but dressed with too many doors and the engine in the wrong place.

I like to use the lay or the non "car guy" person as my definer of super cars. If they see it and say it's a super car than it ls a super car. They don't ruin it with stats, performance numbers or similar arguments noted in this thread. Car guys ruin cars. Never will any of the non car people call out a 4 door car as a super car. And that's a good thing. Because they should stand out. A super car should be super eye catchy, super fast, super expensive and most importantly super sexy. all that is what makes them a super car. They should stand out in every way and never blend into the crowd. You buy this M5 because you want an awesome, fast and practical car and it's a nice humble brag. You buy a super car because of the exclusivity, rarity and to let everyone know you made it.

Interesting that you didn't mention anything about the driving experience in your last sentence. I think that's the primary reason why people buy supercars.

If people bought super cars solely for driving experience, which is subjective I guess, most of the sales of those vehicles would be far lower than they are. I haven't driven many but I know Lamborghinis for a fact and as my example are insanity. The entire car is a blind spot, visibility is non existent, the cars are so low that you have to adjust your route based on the roads conditions. parking lots, parking garages and driveways? Forget about it unless you researched the spot prior. You can't even back a Lamborghini up without opening the door and sitting on the door sill or having someone guide you. All of that to me adds up to "driving experience". My M3 blows all of that out of the water. I can see everything, I can drive it on any public street and park it anywhere I want, plus the performance is more than enough for any public streets. Lamborghini on a track or an open road is probably a different story.

That being said, if money were no option, I would definitely throw a few super cars into the mix but not for the amazing "driving experience", I'm a car guy who likes beautiful cars and if I was on an island alone I'd still want one just for myself.

I never said solely for the driving experience, but rather it being a primary reason. There are people who buy these things for the experience rather than the image. In fact, the image/attention aspect may be more of a deterrent for some.

Comparing the practicality of a BMW with a Lambo is missing the point. Supercars should prioritize emotion over convenience or ease of use. My Countach offers near zero rearward visibility, has no power steering, a ridiculously stiff clutch, a useless A/C and takes 20 minutes to warm up before it changes gears smoothly (I use that term very loosely).

It's a big go kart with a bellowing V12 behind your head. I look forward to every drive.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSurfer

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by LakeSurfer

The title of the video is "super car in disguise". Meaning it has the performance and guts of a super car but dressed with too many doors and the engine in the wrong place.

I like to use the lay or the non "car guy" person as my definer of super cars. If they see it and say it's a super car than it ls a super car. They don't ruin it with stats, performance numbers or similar arguments noted in this thread. Car guys ruin cars. Never will any of the non car people call out a 4 door car as a super car. And that's a good thing. Because they should stand out. A super car should be super eye catchy, super fast, super expensive and most importantly super sexy. all that is what makes them a super car. They should stand out in every way and never blend into the crowd. You buy this M5 because you want an awesome, fast and practical car and it's a nice humble brag. You buy a super car because of the exclusivity, rarity and to let everyone know you made it.

Interesting that you didn't mention anything about the driving experience in your last sentence. I think that's the primary reason why people buy supercars.

If people bought super cars solely for driving experience, which is subjective I guess, most of the sales of those vehicles would be far lower than they are. I haven't driven many but I know Lamborghinis for a fact and as my example are insanity. The entire car is a blind spot, visibility is non existent, the cars are so low that you have to adjust your route based on the roads conditions. parking lots, parking garages and driveways? Forget about it unless you researched the spot prior. You can't even back a Lamborghini up without opening the door and sitting on the door sill or having someone guide you. All of that to me adds up to "driving experience". My M3 blows all of that out of the water. I can see everything, I can drive it on any public street and park it anywhere I want, plus the performance is more than enough for any public streets. Lamborghini on a track or an open road is probably a different story.

That being said, if money were no option, I would definitely throw a few super cars into the mix but not for the amazing "driving experience", I'm a car guy who likes beautiful cars and if I was on an island alone I'd still want one just for myself.

I never said solely for the driving experience, but rather it being a primary reason. There are people who buy these things for the experience rather than the image. In fact, the image/attention aspect may be more of a deterrent for some.

Comparing the practicality of a BMW with a Lambo is missing the point. Supercars should prioritize emotion over convenience or ease of use. My Countach offers near zero rearward visibility, has no power steering, a ridiculously stiff clutch, a useless A/C and takes 20 minutes to warm up before it changes gears smoothly (I use that term very loosely).

It's a big go kart with a bellowing V12 behind your head. I look forward to every drive.

So is the Countach considered a supercar today? Serious question. Is this something that changes? It does still have the wow factor to some and exclusivity, but not the supercar performance of today's high performance cars.

It's a classic super car. I'm not aware of cars being 'demoted' due to age.

crypto · 01-12-2022, 12:10 PM

Quote:

So is the Countach considered a supercar today? Serious question. Is this something that changes? It does still have the wow factor to some and exclusivity, but not the supercar performance of today's high performance cars.

It's a classic super car. I'm not aware of cars being 'demoted' due to age.

If I was able to get a poster of it at my elementary school book-fair… it's a super car.

Chicane_ · 01-12-2022, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crypto

Quote:

So is the Countach considered a supercar today? Serious question. Is this something that changes? It does still have the wow factor to some and exclusivity, but not the supercar performance of today's high performance cars.

It's a classic super car. I'm not aware of cars being 'demoted' due to age.

If I was able to get a poster of it at my elementary school book-fair… it's a super car.

Still looks pretty super to me.

AHall · 01-12-2022, 04:58 PM

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Chicane_ · 01-12-2022, 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Not my Rolls. I have a smattering of different classic and modern exotics from various manufacturers (Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, McLaren, AMG) plus a few Bimmers (M2 CS, M5 CS, M4 GTS).

Jaymelo238 · 01-13-2022, 06:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Not my Rolls. I have a smattering of different classic and modern exotics from various manufacturers (Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, McLaren, AMG) plus a few Bimmers (M2 CS, M5 CS, M4 GTS).

I love Mclarens , they are fast but they are the biggest piece of shit in terms of quality.

Nightmare stories of lemon cars and cars staying in the shop.

I hope the new Artura can change that!

phoenixbmwlife · 01-13-2022, 07:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaymelo238

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Not my Rolls. I have a smattering of different classic and modern exotics from various manufacturers (Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, McLaren, AMG) plus a few Bimmers (M2 CS, M5 CS, M4 GTS).

I love Mclarens , they are fast but they are the biggest piece of shit in terms of quality.

Nightmare stories of lemon cars and cars staying in the shop.

I hope the new Artura can change that!

Which Mclarens have you owned? I was interested in the Artura as my first but might just end up with a used F12. I'm not happy with the sound of the 6 cylinder.

Chicane_ · 01-13-2022, 07:22 AM

I've owned 5 (still have 3) and have had pretty good luck with them. Obviously not perfect but certainly nothing that has scared me away from the brand. I also have friends who own them so I'd probably hear about their horror stories if they had any.

I generally prefer real world experience and direct evidence vs anecdotal experiences posted by internet strangers.

Chicane_ · 01-13-2022, 07:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixbmwlife

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaymelo238

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Not my Rolls. I have a smattering of different classic and modern exotics from various manufacturers (Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, McLaren, AMG) plus a few Bimmers (M2 CS, M5 CS, M4 GTS).

I love Mclarens , they are fast but they are the biggest piece of shit in terms of quality.

Nightmare stories of lemon cars and cars staying in the shop.

I hope the new Artura can change that!

Which Mclarens have you owned? I was interested in the Artura as my first but might just end up with a used F12. I'm not happy with the sound of the 6 cylinder.

My advice is to grab a 675LT. They're a bargain and still the most exciting car that McLaren has made in my opinion.

Jaymelo238 · 01-13-2022, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixbmwlife

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaymelo238

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Not my Rolls. I have a smattering of different classic and modern exotics from various manufacturers (Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, McLaren, AMG) plus a few Bimmers (M2 CS, M5 CS, M4 GTS).

I love Mclarens , they are fast but they are the biggest piece of shit in terms of quality.

Nightmare stories of lemon cars and cars staying in the shop.

I hope the new Artura can change that!

Which Mclarens have you owned? I was interested in the Artura as my first but might just end up with a used F12. I'm not happy with the sound of the 6 cylinder.

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixbmwlife

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaymelo238

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Not my Rolls. I have a smattering of different classic and modern exotics from various manufacturers (Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, McLaren, AMG) plus a few Bimmers (M2 CS, M5 CS, M4 GTS).

I love Mclarens , they are fast but they are the biggest piece of shit in terms of quality.

Nightmare stories of lemon cars and cars staying in the shop.

I hope the new Artura can change that!

Which Mclarens have you owned? I was interested in the Artura as my first but might just end up with a used F12. I'm not happy with the sound of the 6 cylinder.

I had the 570s for a little while and had so many electrical problems. I will be going for either the Hurcan sto or 812 Ferrari. I am sure Mclaren will fix this since they are one of the best , it's just Ferrari and Lamborghini have been making cars longer.

MadBimmeRad · 01-13-2022, 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixbmwlife

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaymelo238

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Not my Rolls. I have a smattering of different classic and modern exotics from various manufacturers (Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, McLaren, AMG) plus a few Bimmers (M2 CS, M5 CS, M4 GTS).

I love Mclarens , they are fast but they are the biggest piece of shit in terms of quality.

Nightmare stories of lemon cars and cars staying in the shop.

I hope the new Artura can change that!

Which Mclarens have you owned? I was interested in the Artura as my first but might just end up with a used F12. I'm not happy with the sound of the 6 cylinder.

My advice is to grab a 675LT. They're a bargain and still the most exciting car that McLaren has made in my opinion.

I'm so jealous of you Americans.

When you say get 675LT, because it's a bargain, the cheapest one in Australia is over half a mill and certainly not a bargain

mjr24 · 01-14-2022, 08:16 PM

I'm not saying it's a bad car by any means….but I don't feel it looks amazing. The colors seem boring. Then add in the $25k markup or whatever some dealers are charging? Hard pass.

For that much, I'd buy something more exotic. Just my 0.02.

phoenixbmwlife · 01-14-2022, 09:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjr24

I'm not saying it's a bad car by any means….but I don't feel it looks amazing. The colors seem boring. Then add in the $25k markup or whatever some dealers are charging? Hard pass.

For that much, I'd buy something more exotic. Just my 0.02.

Lol when you buy something more exotic you will still have to pay a premium. Everything exotic is selling for over MSRP. If you can get an allocation.

mjr24 · 01-14-2022, 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixbmwlife

Lol when you buy something more exotic you will still have to pay a premium. Everything exotic is selling for over MSRP. If you can get an allocation.

Oh no doubt.....the M5CS just isn't something I'd pay a premium for (meaning over MSRP).

Kstoff125 · 01-14-2022, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixbmwlife

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaymelo238

Quote:

Originally Posted by Chicane_

Quote:

Originally Posted by AHall

Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?

Not my Rolls. I have a smattering of different classic and modern exotics from various manufacturers (Porsche, Lambo, Ferrari, McLaren, AMG) plus a few Bimmers (M2 CS, M5 CS, M4 GTS).

I love Mclarens , they are fast but they are the biggest piece of shit in terms of quality.

Nightmare stories of lemon cars and cars staying in the shop.

I hope the new Artura can change that!

Which Mclarens have you owned? I was interested in the Artura as my first but might just end up with a used F12. I'm not happy with the sound of the 6 cylinder.

Get the F12 over any maclaren. There is something special about a Ferrari. Anyone that has visited Maranello will agree

stefan · 01-15-2022, 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mjr24

I'm not saying it's a bad car by any means….but I don't feel it looks amazing. The colors seem boring. Then add in the $25k markup or whatever some dealers are charging? Hard pass.

For that much, I'd buy something more exotic. Just my 0.02.

to me that is 100% its appeal.

AbdullahMDM · 01-15-2022, 04:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluehorseshoe

You're missing the subtleties of his praiseful comments, Trevor. It's about the total package. It is indeed 'magic' how BMW's tuned this car. I still scratch my head every time I take it out. Not easy to make a car with such dynamics so enjoyable at two-tenths normal road driving. Far from perfect, of course. But for a $150k luxury sedan (cheap relative to many alternatives), it's just about as close as they come.

Where can I find one for 150k? last time I checked they were going for 180k + with mileage on them. Brand new ones are going for around 200k in Saudi Arabia

MadBimmeRad · 01-15-2022, 04:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AbdullahMDM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bluehorseshoe

You're missing the subtleties of his praiseful comments, Trevor. It's about the total package. It is indeed 'magic' how BMW's tuned this car. I still scratch my head every time I take it out. Not easy to make a car with such dynamics so enjoyable at two-tenths normal road driving. Far from perfect, of course. But for a $150k luxury sedan (cheap relative to many alternatives), it's just about as close as they come.

Where can I find one for 150k? last time I checked they were going for 180k + with mileage on them. Brand new ones are going for around 200k in Saudi Arabia

You should feel lucky you don't live in Australia

Try this for a head-spinner

Check out this 2021 BMW M5 CS F90 LCI Auto M xDrive.
https://www.carsales.com.au/cars/det...AG-AD-20173213

01-12-2022, 08:34 AM	#114
stefan Brigadier General 2354 Rep 4,254 Posts Drives: M2 Comp Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: North iTrader: (2)	One of the reasons this car has completely hit the top of my list is the fact that it sorta makes me feel the way BMW used to where they are competing with exotic manufacturers. Remember that euro E36 ad comparing the hp per litre to Ferrari? This car feels like that. BMW punching way above its weight and dominating like it used to generations ago. In person this car has an amazing presence. In true M5 fashion it is clearly special to those in the know but relatively stealthy otherwise. My E39 left a huge impression on me. Probably shouldn't have sold. I'd happily buy an M5CS over any of its equally priced competitors without hesitation. There is nothing else at this price range that I can logically see myself driving every day. __________________ ///M Power
	Appreciate 1 Day Laborer1746.00 Quote

01-12-2022, 04:58 PM	#118
AHall Lieutenant Colonel 982 Rep 1,797 Posts Drives: 1993 Nissan 240sx Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Frisco, Texas iTrader: (0)	Chicane is that your Rolls? What else you got?
	Appreciate 0 Quote

01-13-2022, 07:22 AM	#122
Chicane_ Lieutenant 1050 Rep 476 Posts Drives: G80 M3 CS + other stuff Join Date: Jan 2021 Location: Earth iTrader: (0)	I've owned 5 (still have 3) and have had pretty good luck with them. Obviously not perfect but certainly nothing that has scared me away from the brand. I also have friends who own them so I'd probably hear about their horror stories if they had any. I generally prefer real world experience and direct evidence vs anecdotal experiences posted by internet strangers.
	Appreciate 2 phoenixbmwlife1912.50 Ex_Stig2594.00 Quote

01-14-2022, 08:16 PM	#126
mjr24 Colonel 1650 Rep 2,402 Posts Drives: M8 Comp GC, X7, AMG GT53 Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Wisconsin iTrader: (0)	I'm not saying it's a bad car by any means….but I don't feel it looks amazing. The colors seem boring. Then add in the $25k markup or whatever some dealers are charging? Hard pass. For that much, I'd buy something more exotic. Just my 0.02. __________________ 2022 M8 Comp GC, 2021 AMG GT53, 2022 X5M Competition, 2021 X7 40i, 2019 M5, 2018 M550I, 2017 Audi Q7, 2014 M6 GC, 2013 Mercedes CLS550, 2011 750LI, 2008 M6 Cabrio, 2008 Porsche Cayenne S, 2004 Mercedes SL55 AMG, 2003 Mercedes SL500, 2000 Mercedes CL500, 1993 Lexus SC400, 1989 525i, 1985 318i
	Appreciate 0 Quote