[JK-M5]

Which company offers the best output on the F90.

ive been watching Race chips vids and seems a very bold statement to increase a stock motor by 140+ bhp

anyone else run a proven product with the same gains

asking for a friend 😉

[Miko M]

RC is gaining about 70HP ( stock is about 675 hp measured on Dyno ) and no matter what piggy back you will get it's hard to get more unless you do a tune.

[Steeve19M5CP]

Originally Posted by Miko M

RC is gaining about 70HP ( stock is about 675 hp measured on Dyno ) and no matter what piggy back you will get it's hard to get more unless you do a tune.

Rc black and bms stage 1 are comparable piggybacks....both should produce about 660whp on a dynojet.....620whp stock....increase of about 40whp

The bms JB4 piggyback has more options and higher HP maps ....you can switch from oem HP to 660whp on 93 octane and up to 690whp with racing fuel.....no tuning

[Pimpsy]

Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP

Rc black and bms stage 1 are comparable piggybacks....both should produce about 660whp on a dynojet.....620whp stock....increase of about 40whp

The bms JB4 piggyback has more options and higher HP maps ....you can switch from oem HP to 660whp on 93 octane and up to 690whp with racing fuel.....no tuning

RC claims +119 HP for the M5C using the GTS Black. Where are you getting an increase of 40 HP?
Thanks.

[Mike@N54Tuning.com]

Originally Posted by Mboy

Which company offers the best output on the F90.

ive been watching Race chips vids and seems a very bold statement to increase a stock motor by 140+ bhp

anyone else run a proven product with the same gains

asking for a friend 😉

There are the simple 2 channel controllers like BMS Stage1 and RaceChip that will give 40-50hp, and then for those who want power that rivals flash tuning you need the JB4, which can be set for anywhere from 40-120hp. The JB4 has CANbus and electronic wastegate control which are why it can deliver so much more power than the basic tuner systems. It also has a variety of useful features like on the fly map changes using your BC button or phone app, extra passive safety systems, light E85 mixture support, can read/delete fault codes, and much more.

Mike

[LongBeachDinanFan]

Originally Posted by Pimpsy

RC claims +119 HP for the M5C using the GTS Black. Where are you getting an increase of 40 HP?
Thanks.

It is a lie RaceChip does not provide an actual dyno like other tuners they just make up what they think their customers want to see. I have been following the threads here and the RaceChip for F90 adds 2-4mph traps so it's 40-50hp tops probably less.

[onfireX5]

Here is the RaceChip Maha dyno of a stock M5 F90. The RWHP is 555hp. That's the only number worth measuring IMHO, as I do not like the conversion factors used to extrapolate engine hp. 555 is an actual measured result on that style dyno on that day.

[onfireX5]

Here is the RaceChip dyno with their chip installed on SetPoint 7. Again, forget about the engine conversion numbers. 622 rwhp as tested on the same Maha dyno.

[Steeve19M5CP]

Translation Racechip map7/race gives out 67whp?

[onfireX5]

Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP

Translation Racechip map7/race gives out 67whp?

On a Maha dyno at those atmospheric conditions, yes.

[Steeve19M5CP]

Originally Posted by onfireX5

On a Maha dyno at those atmospheric conditions, yes.

To compare Burger stage one is 44whp on Dynojet




Racechip dyno;

racechip: 747ps = 737HP = 650whp (15% loss)
stock: 665ps = 656HP = 571whp (15% loss)

79whp increase

[Steeve19M5CP]

Too bad we dont have the air fuel ratio plotted on graphs

[onfireX5]

Originally Posted by Steeve19M5CP

Too bad we dont have the air fuel ratio plotted on graphs

Nothing against RC, but I would not convert backwards from their “engine “ ratings since it has already been converted forwards. Those conversions have too many assumptions in them that can not be verified. (But that’s just me).

[mike@x-ph.com]

Jb4 is the king (or queen) of piggybacks

[JK-M5]

Thats the answer i was looking for, thanks for putting up the evidence with the graphs.

I do think 67bhp is not bad for a simple plug in, and proves Race chip is worth fitting for the gain just not the gains they say.

Thanks again Gents

[limeypride]

Originally Posted by Mboy

Thats the answer i was looking for, thanks for putting up the evidence with the graphs.

I do think 67bhp is not bad for a simple plug in, and proves Race chip is worth fitting for the gain just not the gains they say.

Thanks again Gents

I have a JB4... so I'm biased I guess.

That said, graphs from different cars on different dynos on different days in different places are utterly meaningless; ambient temp alone can alter the readings substantially as can altitude, fuel octane, etc.

To my point: you don't have enough data here to conclude one is better than the other. Look around for 1/4 mile dragrace results or side-by-side comparos of the two devices (I don't think the latter exists but I haven't made a concerted effort to find it myself).

I know the JB will put a smile on your (the owner's) face and my best guess is that the RC will, too. If you (the owner) wants something closer to the ultimate, go for an ECU tune (riskier given BMW's recently increased scrutiny and warranty questions) or the full JB4 (more expensive, more customizable, more complicated to install, more logging, much more power).

[turbomcgee]

Originally Posted by Mboy

Which company offers the best output on the F90.

ive been watching Race chips vids and seems a very bold statement to increase a stock motor by 140+ bhp

anyone else run a proven product with the same gains

asking for a friend ��

BMS stage 1 and the Race chip do nearly the same exact thing, they add up to 4psi more boost by tricking the factory map sensor info allowing more boost.

4psi is not getting you 140+hp on these car.

you're going to get 10-15whp per psi on these turbos running pump gas, while remaining in the compressors efficiency.

so 4psi is 40-60whp depending how the wind blows.

Also looking at dragy, they pretty much preform the same considering DA can sway these performance number greatly.

Are you the kinda guy or girl who never wants to datalog?
Do you want a little more power but nothing serious?
If so go with the RC or BMS stage 1

If you want the ability to add more power at any given time with higher boost maps or datalog you should go with a BMS JB4.

So the red pill or the blue pill? the choice is yours

- for reference I have a Jb4, do daily WOT pulls unless its snowing or raining and datalog almost every single one as I'm always messing with a custom map.

Enjoy!

[JK-M5]

Are you the kinda guy or girl who never wants to datalog?
Do you want a little more power but nothing serious?
If so go with the RC or BMS stage 1


Data logging not really, its a daily car so taking it to events to compare data is not my thing.

I know these Engines suffer rod failure which happened on my last F10 so i don't want to go down this route again.
a simple increase is enough for me this time and this is something i'll do after a year of owning the car just to keep the smile on my face, for now i'm testing the waters and trying to find out if this new engine can take it, i don't want to be the first to bend a rod

[josec70]

Originally Posted by Mboy

Are you the kinda guy or girl who never wants to datalog?
Do you want a little more power but nothing serious?
If so go with the RC or BMS stage 1


Data logging not really, its a daily car so taking it to events to compare data is not my thing.

I know these Engines suffer rod failure which happened on my last F10 so i don't want to go down this route again.
a simple increase is enough for me this time and this is something i'll do after a year of owning the car just to keep the smile on my face, for now i'm testing the waters and trying to find out if this new engine can take it, i don't want to be the first to bend a rod

Wise .. saw many a bent rod / blown engine in the F10 M5 world. Piggy will be m ore than enough for me but will wait it out a bit.

[Catchmeifyoucanf90]

How about boost mod 3 when it comes out in the summer?

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by turbomcgee

BMS stage 1 and the Race chip do nearly the same exact thing, they add up to 4psi more boost by tricking the factory map sensor info allowing more boost.

4psi is not getting you 140+hp on these car.

you're going to get 10-15whp per psi on these turbos running pump gas, while remaining in the compressors efficiency.

so 4psi is 40-60whp depending how the wind blows.

Also looking at dragy, they pretty much preform the same considering DA can sway these performance number greatly.

Are you the kinda guy or girl who never wants to datalog?
Do you want a little more power but nothing serious?
If so go with the RC or BMS stage 1

If you want the ability to add more power at any given time with higher boost maps or datalog you should go with a BMS JB4.

So the red pill or the blue pill? the choice is yours

- for reference I have a Jb4, do daily WOT pulls unless its snowing or raining and datalog almost every single one as I'm always messing with a custom map.

Enjoy!

+1

I would like to also add that the JB4 has an extra layer of safety, it monitors boost and AFR and sends the car back to stock map if anything goes wrong.

It also has features like boost by gear and RPM + bluetooth.

As mentioned above, for something quick and cheap get the stage 1.
For max power and features, invest in the JB4

[limeypride]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

+1

I would like to also add that the JB4 has an extra layer of safety, it monitors boost and AFR and sends the car back to stock map if anything goes wrong.

It also has features like boost by gear and RPM + bluetooth.

As mentioned above, for something quick and cheap get the stage 1.
For max power and features, invest in the JB4

Correct me if I'm wrong, but boost & AFR monitoring require the JB4 with OBD II hooked up, right?

Boost by gear and by RPM do--I have firsthand experience there having broken anything other than map 1 through coding because the needed modules auto-locked themselves out. Fixed now but boy it wasn't easy; warranty questions were also raised. Note that the warranty questions had *nothing* to do with JB4--it was not detected. The warranty concerns were raised when the coding changes were detected.