[Desking101]

Can't seem to find a definitive answer on this.

I'm currently fully stock except with a racechip gts black. On an E25 mix I run map 7. I have no issues, however could always use a little more power if I can on the stock downpipes, and without running a flex fuel kit for higher E content.

Using the bootmod3 OTS maps, on 91 octane or E25 (I switch between both), will I make more power vs. the racechip and will it be as reliable?

Or is it not really worth the switch unless I get custom tunes (don't need a blown engine so want to avoid this)

[mike@x-ph.com]

The bm3 is the better tune; it will also make more power and more reliable.

If your DME is not locked, I recommend you upgrade to bm3

If your DME is locked, it's not worth the trouble and money for what you are doing.

[Desking101]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

The bm3 is the better tune; it will also make more power and more reliable.

If your DME is not locked, I recommend you upgrade to bm3

If your DME is locked, it's not worth the trouble and money for what you are doing.

Is there a way to check if mine is locked?

[dougpaper]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

The bm3 is the better tune; it will also make more power and more reliable.

If your DME is not locked, I recommend you upgrade to bm3

If your DME is locked, it's not worth the trouble and money for what you are doing.

so my 2019 non competition, i have run the race chip black for the past few years. What makes the bootmod3 safer and since i don't have any cables or software is this a difficult thing to upload in my car?
Thanks

I got the mad mid pipes from you and they are fantstic, crazy they have pulled a cel light when i really abuse it. dealer resets it for me.

[Desking101]

I ended up buying the bm3 and the addon where I can get more OTS tunes, and waiting for the wifi adapter to come in the mail. Now I'm just wondering about fueling. I see they have 91, 93, and E30 tunes. I know these cars can adjust up to E25 which is what I've run a lot. Should I run just the 93 octane tune when I'm on E25? Or should I run the E30 tune even though I'm 5% short? I'm thinking that might not be safe if they're running a lot more timing

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by dougpaper

so my 2019 non competition, i have run the race chip black for the past few years. What makes the bootmod3 safer and since i don't have any cables or software is this a difficult thing to upload in my car?
Thanks

I got the mad mid pipes from you and they are fantstic, crazy they have pulled a cel light when i really abuse it. dealer resets it for me.

bm3 is a full flash tune meaning you remap the tuning table entirely.

Race chip is a piggyback, it tricks the ECU into thinking the car is not making enough power so it adds more boost.

Please note i did not say bm3 is safer (both are pretty safe), i said its the better tune

[Kponti]

Can BM3 make more power than racechip assuming 93 octane and same physical mods?

[pbonsalb]

This is a good primer if you want to learn more about BM3. https://f90.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...&highlight=BM3

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by Kponti

Can BM3 make more power than racechip assuming 93 octane and same physical mods?

Yes Bootmod3 can make more power than a piggy on 93 octane.

The piggyback is limited to adding boost only, with lower-quality fuel like 93, you cant add much boost.

When you are using a flash tune like bootmod3, bm3 lowers the ignition timing allowing you more head room to add more boost.

[Kponti]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

This is a good primer if you want to learn more about BM3. https://f90.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh...&highlight=BM3

Great link and like all mods that mess with the base coding of a car's ECU, the safety threshold is mostly lowered to achieve more power. So while the tune is safer (afr linear, timing lowered, etc etc), bad gas and an unexpected unhealthy part could cause a blowup that a stock tune could have managed

I'm not saying this cos I don't like tunes, I prefer tuning over piggybacks for sure but I've blown 2 engines from so called safe tunes and never from a piggyback over the last 26 years. Some of the piggy's were crap and made the car run like shit in some cases even.

BM3 in itself is not safe, it can be used to produce safe tunes is what that link shows. But it can also be used to create unsafe tunes.

[Kponti]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

Yes Bootmod3 can make more power than a piggy on 93 octane.

The piggyback is limited to adding boost only, with lower-quality fuel like 93, you cant add much boost.

When you are using a flash tune like bootmod3, bm3 lowers the ignition timing allowing you more head room to add more boost.

Gotcha, yeah I can see that. I guess my question should be reworded to "does lowering your timing and increasing boost more make more power than raising boost slightly but keeping timing at near stock levels?"

I come from the MB world and timing not boost is usually where the power is made safely so this is a new world for me.
Folks (myself included) lose engines faster with more boost lower timing combos than slight increases in boost and higher timing from my experience in the AMG engines.

[pbonsalb]

Originally Posted by Kponti

BM3 in itself is not safe, it can be used to produce safe tunes is what that link shows. But it can also be used to create unsafe tunes.

I have run JB4 on 2 BMW, Procede on 1 BMW, AA and TT flash tunes on 1 BMW and BM3 on 1 BMW. An idiot or a person who thinks they know more than they know can screw up a car with a piggyback or flash tune. I don’t try to be a tuner and customize myself. I also typically use water/meth injection for safety, though sometimes I have had it incorporated into the tune. Never had a problem that I can’t blame myself for — in 2007, I blew a supercharged S52 engine because I did not have enough fuel flow. No problems since. I read and research and do all my own work, apart from having a motor built in 2014. Data logging is a great tool and I plan to do more of it this year.

[mike@x-ph.com]

Originally Posted by Kponti

Gotcha, yeah I can see that. I guess my question should be reworded to "does lowering your timing and increasing boost more make more power than raising boost slightly but keeping timing at near stock levels?"

I come from the MB world and timing not boost is usually where the power is made safely so this is a new world for me.
Folks (myself included) lose engines faster with more boost lower timing combos than slight increases in boost and higher timing from my experience in the AMG engines.

In most you can extract more power by lowering ignition and increasing boost.

[Kponti]

Originally Posted by mike@x-ph.com

In most you can extract more power by lowering ignition and increasing boost.

That is a lot more like back in my domestic supercharged/turbo days, low low timing and as much boost as your head gasket can handle and as long as you had fuel, you were good for 100k miles of abuse.

Well I am stuck at low 10s @133mph with my car currently. Was looking into swapping the Racechip for JB4 with more connections for more power. But I will look into Femto and a BM3 (HCP vs Utku....that's another story) for that 138-140mph trap speeds, high 5s 60-130 (if I am going there, I'm going all the way lol)

[916_M5]

Originally Posted by Kponti

That is a lot more like back in my domestic supercharged/turbo days, low low timing and as much boost as your head gasket can handle and as long as you had fuel, you were good for 100k miles of abuse.

Well I am stuck at low 10s @133mph with my car currently. Was looking into swapping the Racechip for JB4 with more connections for more power. But I will look into Femto and a BM3 (HCP vs Utku....that's another story) for that 138-140mph trap speeds, high 5s 60-130 (if I am going there, I'm going all the way lol)

Low 10s on JB4 is excellent !

[pbonsalb]

BMS did low 10s at over 136 with the JB4 plus intakes but stock downpipes several years ago, but on E30.

[Kponti]

Originally Posted by 916_M5

Low 10s on JB4 is excellent !

Mine is with the Racechip on 93 octane. Ido also have the Dinan Inlet and ER secondaries.

[916_M5]

Originally Posted by Kponti

Mine is with the Racechip on 93 octane. Ido also have the Dinan Inlet and ER secondaries.

Damn these are great times for a piggy back!!!

[Kponti]

Originally Posted by 916_M5

Damn these are great times for a piggy back!!!

It is an M8 coupe, but I figured would not be much different from my old F90