[Rafichicago]

So i went out and took a photo of the caliper / wheels clearance. Unless there is a significant difference in wheel barrel design I don't know how would you fit 19" wheels over those brakes. And yes. They save weight and have greater stopping power from steels. Brake fade is basically non existent. The only reason people tend not to track them is stupid cost of running them. I chose this M5 example because it had carbon ceramics and we have never had car with them, so we wanted to see how they are. Because car was/is used we bought it. We don't buy new cars because it doesn't seem to be the smartest financial option. Would I tick the option when buying new ? Absolutely not. And definitely not to keep wheels from brake dust.
Ha ha sorry for dirty wheels guys 😂😂😂

[Neptune7]

Originally Posted by shawnhayes

Looked like the gold calipers to me too, but I think the P4S's equilibrated both cars to the exact same.

And I have to agree on the CCB's feel. Is it programming or the different master cylinder?

Shawn

That's a great question. My guess is programming.

[jnotrom711]

Originally Posted by shawnhayes

They're not the same. The CCB rotor is a few mm bigger. The CCB caliper is a few mm further out from the hub, but it ain't MUCH.

Good information thanks.

Yes, the CCB rotor is a 410MM, I believe, and the steel 394MM, equates to just a tad over 1/2 inch in total diameter, and little over 1/4" on a radius.

The question I have is, is the caliper the same? Or is it just mounted .25" further from the center hub.

It looks like you have no issues with the steel on a CCB car, is the opposite true? If one wanted to add CCB discs and pads? Would the steel calipers and set up work?

And yes, 19's would be tight, but they're tight with the steels also. I was more commenting that nearly any wheel that fits over the steel SHOULD fit over the CCBs as well (should), that is, if the caliper is mounted in the same place. If not there is about a .25" to play with before the CCB calipers would hit the inside of of a wheel on the front.

Racing Brake makes a set of CCB rotors as a steel replacement upgrade... With that said Shawn, do you know if going this route would be as simple as putting the CCB rotors/pads on a steel car and good to go? Either Racing Brake option or OEM? With out having to change calipers, coding, master cylnder or booster?

Edit: Ill add this, I did just for fun look at the parts list, and the steering knuckle (I think) is what the caliper bolts to, and its the same part number for CCB or steel. So the mount essentially is the same. The calipers appear to be the same and they have the same part number with the exception of the last 3, which would be 937, 938 (steel R& L) 939, and 940 (CCB R & L)

And the calipers are the same price, not sure if the BMW Parts codes the last 3 decode a color? Or an actual part change.

A lot of times the part codes the last digits are a color, and the rest of the digits are identical, with a minor change to a digits for color. If its a completely different part, it would usually have more than just the last 3 different. For example a door panel, that is identical and will fit all f90s, the entire part number is the same except last 3 digits, for different colors, but the rest remains the same, because it would fit on all f90, regardless the color. Just wouldn't match the color.

[jnotrom711]

Originally Posted by Rafichicago

So i went out and took a photo of the caliper / wheels clearance. Unless there is a significant difference in wheel barrel design I don't know how would you fit 19" wheels over those brakes. And yes. They save weight and have greater stopping power from steels. Brake fade is basically non existent. The only reason people tend not to track them is stupid cost of running them. I chose this M5 example because it had carbon ceramics and we have never had car with them, so we wanted to see how they are. Because car was/is used we bought it. We don't buy new cars because it doesn't seem to be the smartest financial option. Would I tick the option when buying new ? Absolutely not. And definitely not to keep wheels from brake dust.
Ha ha sorry for dirty wheels guys ������

This guy... "sorry for the dirty wheels"... save it LMAO.... Your pictures VS mine here, should be reason enough to buy a CCB car. LOL.... I just washed the car 3 days ago... Not a deep brake clean, but as you can see its quite obviously night and day difference between the dirt and filth the steels cause.

But to me the steel caliper looks to have similar clearance. But hard to say. As i'm sure it depends on the wheel. I have 789M 20", by the looks of it it wouldn't appear 19" would fit on either car. But they do, at least the OEM M5 19s fit on both. IDK

[pbonsalb]

Originally Posted by Rafichicago

I don't know how would you fit 19" wheels over those brakes.

As noted above, people run 19” BMW snow wheels over CCBs.
https://f90.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1771101

[Rafichicago]

Originally Posted by pbonsalb

As noted above, people run 19” BMW snow wheels over CCBs.
https://f90.bimmerpost.com/forums/sh....php?t=1771101

We learn something new everyday day 👍

[pbonsalb]

Does seem odd since apparently the dealer says no and I don’t think you can order a car with CCB and 19s. But people are doing it and they aren’t saying they are using spacers. I had to use spacers on my stock 18” E90 M3 front wheels when running Stoptech ST60 with 380mm rotors but no spacers when running aftermarket Apex 18” wheels (snows on the stock wheels).

[shawnhayes]

Originally Posted by jnotrom711

Good information thanks.

Yes, the CCB rotor is a 410MM, I believe, and the steel 394MM, equates to just a tad over 1/2 inch in total diameter, and little over 1/4" on a radius.

The question I have is, is the caliper the same? Or is it just mounted .25" further from the center hub.

It looks like you have no issues with the steel on a CCB car, is the opposite true? If one wanted to add CCB discs and pads? Would the steel calipers and set up work?

And yes, 19's would be tight, but they're tight with the steels also. I was more commenting that nearly any wheel that fits over the steel SHOULD fit over the CCBs as well (should), that is, if the caliper is mounted in the same place. If not there is about a .25" to play with before the CCB calipers would hit the inside of of a wheel on the front.

Racing Brake makes a set of CCB rotors as a steel replacement upgrade... With that said Shawn, do you know if going this route would be as simple as putting the CCB rotors/pads on a steel car and good to go? Either Racing Brake option or OEM? With out having to change calipers, coding, master cylnder or booster?

Edit: Ill add this, I did just for fun look at the parts list, and the steering knuckle (I think) is what the caliper bolts to, and its the same part number for CCB or steel. So the mount essentially is the same. The calipers appear to be the same and they have the same part number with the exception of the last 3, which would be 937, 938 (steel R& L) 939, and 940 (CCB R & L)

And the calipers are the same price, not sure if the BMW Parts codes the last 3 decode a color? Or an actual part change.

A lot of times the part codes the last digits are a color, and the rest of the digits are identical, with a minor change to a digits for color. If its a completely different part, it would usually have more than just the last 3 different. For example a door panel, that is identical and will fit all f90s, the entire part number is the same except last 3 digits, for different colors, but the rest remains the same, because it would fit on all f90, regardless the color. Just wouldn't match the color.

A lot of information in this to answer, but I'll shoot a little of it. I've had metal 2018 M5 and 2022 M5 CS.

I don't think the rotors are that much different. I think the F10's CCB's were 410. I think the F90's are 400? My research before I did the test fit said that the pad would move out max 4mm. I didn't know about the inner border (I didn't measure the pads). But the fitment is perfect for CCB's using metal.

The difference is ONLY the rotor and the caliper. Looks like the mounting edge of the caliper is bigger. It just moves it out. (as I said above, I think it was 4mm).

As far as metal to CCB, I think the ONLY way to know is to test fit. You put the CCB rotor in and hope the blue caliper doesn't clang it while you're fitting it. I don't know for sure.

As far as 19" go, I'll take a picture of my clearance later. My 20" wheel has a TON more clearance than you guys. A TON. I think the barrel on your 20" are beefier. The 19" are less like my wheels.

As far as the CCB's, if you are doing it for brake dust - go with the RacingBrake. They will fit for sure. RacingBrake's rotors are good and heavy duty. I've used them in the past. Putting BMW CCM's on yours are a crapshoot, and we don't know for sure that they'll work. The RacingBrake ones will for sure.

Shawn

[jnotrom711]

Originally Posted by shawnhayes

A lot of information in this to answer, but I'll shoot a little of it. I've had metal 2018 M5 and 2022 M5 CS.

I don't think the rotors are that much different. I think the F10's CCB's were 410. I think the F90's are 400? My research before I did the test fit said that the pad would move out max 4mm. I didn't know about the inner border (I didn't measure the pads). But the fitment is perfect for CCB's using metal.

The difference is ONLY the rotor and the caliper. Looks like the mounting edge of the caliper is bigger. It just moves it out. (as I said above, I think it was 4mm).

As far as metal to CCB, I think the ONLY way to know is to test fit. You put the CCB rotor in and hope the blue caliper doesn't clang it while you're fitting it. I don't know for sure.

As far as 19" go, I'll take a picture of my clearance later. My 20" wheel has a TON more clearance than you guys. A TON. I think the barrel on your 20" are beefier. The 19" are less like my wheels.

As far as the CCB's, if you are doing it for brake dust - go with the RacingBrake. They will fit for sure. RacingBrake's rotors are good and heavy duty. I've used them in the past. Putting BMW CCM's on yours are a crapshoot, and we don't know for sure that they'll work. The RacingBrake ones will for sure.

Shawn

Thank you kindly sir!

As for the photos, its hard to get an accurate representation of the distance, its highly dependent on the angle the photo is taken at. I can make it look like a big or small gap, but tried to take it straight on, however the wheel portion (not sure what to call it) not the inside barrel of the wheel, but also not the spokes of the wheel kind of bevels up higher than the barrel, so depending on the photo it could appear closer. My photos are on a 2019 Comp, steel brakes, with the factory OEM 20" 789M wheels. Not sure on previous poster's wheel.

Oh... and anyone have some carbon rotors and pads they want to part with for the good of the cause? Preferably new, in packaging just so I can test fit them ? And if you want me to dispose of them, I can do that no worries.

[micvite]

Originally Posted by jnotrom711

Good information thanks.

Yes, the CCB rotor is a 410MM, I believe, and the steel 394MM, equates to just a tad over 1/2 inch in total diameter, and little over 1/4" on a radius.

The question I have is, is the caliper the same? Or is it just mounted .25" further from the center hub.

It looks like you have no issues with the steel on a CCB car, is the opposite true? If one wanted to add CCB discs and pads? Would the steel calipers and set up work?

And yes, 19's would be tight, but they're tight with the steels also. I was more commenting that nearly any wheel that fits over the steel SHOULD fit over the CCBs as well (should), that is, if the caliper is mounted in the same place. If not there is about a .25" to play with before the CCB calipers would hit the inside of of a wheel on the front.

Racing Brake makes a set of CCB rotors as a steel replacement upgrade... With that said Shawn, do you know if going this route would be as simple as putting the CCB rotors/pads on a steel car and good to go? Either Racing Brake option or OEM? With out having to change calipers, coding, master cylnder or booster?

Edit: Ill add this, I did just for fun look at the parts list, and the steering knuckle (I think) is what the caliper bolts to, and its the same part number for CCB or steel. So the mount essentially is the same. The calipers appear to be the same and they have the same part number with the exception of the last 3, which would be 937, 938 (steel R& L) 939, and 940 (CCB R & L)

And the calipers are the same price, not sure if the BMW Parts codes the last 3 decode [...]

If they were the same caliper, why would the retrofit kit come with calipers? Wouldn't it be easier to just use the same ones? Also I wasn't able to find separate part numbers for red and black calipers, so it's safe to say the color doesn't change the part number at least from what I was able to find.

Ironically you can't order 19 in wheels with the ccbs, but you can order the winter wheel package which Is 19in so yeah... lol and technically you could just get a set of ccb rotors and pads for the smaller caliper (I believe they're slightly bigger, but fit in the same caliper) and you'd have yourself some more resistant brakes at the least, but the OEM upgrade includes a diff master cylinder as well as coding for the dsc module ig to better take advantage of the ccbs? Perhaps more pressure hence why people say the brakes bite very hard with very little pedal?

[pbonsalb]

With expensive carbon ceramic rotors, I would be really careful testing in steel brakes. If there is reduced clearance, a pebble or other interference could result in an expensive lesson. The ceramic rotors had to be bigger and fatter to offer the same (or, under some circumstances, improved) performance compared to steel. If the calipers are the same thickness, then maybe the ceramic pads are thinner — that would make sense since carbon brakes should last longer.

[shawnhayes]

Originally Posted by jnotrom711

]


Thank you kindly sir!

As for the photos, its hard to get an accurate representation of the distance, its highly dependent on the angle the photo is taken at. I can make it look like a big or small gap, but tried to take it straight on, however the wheel portion (not sure what to call it) not the inside barrel of the wheel, but also not the spokes of the wheel kind of bevels up higher than the barrel, so depending on the photo it could appear closer. My photos are on a 2019 Comp, steel brakes, with the factory OEM 20" 789M wheels. Not sure on previous poster's wheel.

Oh... and anyone have some carbon rotors and pads they want to part with for the good of the cause? Preferably new, in packaging just so I can test fit them ? And if you want me to dispose of them, I can do that no worries.

The gap is damn sure different on mine, but much smaller than I originally remembered. Maybe 1/4" at least, maybe more.

[jnotrom711]

Originally Posted by micvite

If they were the same caliper, why would the retrofit kit come with calipers? Wouldn't it be easier to just use the same ones? Also I wasn't able to find separate part numbers for red and black calipers, so it's safe to say the color doesn't change the part number at least from what I was able to find.

Ironically you can't order 19 in wheels with the ccbs, but you can order the winter wheel package which Is 19in so yeah... lol and technically you could just get a set of ccb rotors and pads for the smaller caliper (I believe they're slightly bigger, but fit in the same caliper) and you'd have yourself some more resistant brakes at the least, but the OEM upgrade includes a diff master cylinder as well as coding for the dsc module ig to better take advantage of the ccbs? Perhaps more pressure hence why people say the brakes bite very hard with very little pedal?

Couldn't tell you on the retro fit kit. But I can tell you, on a door panel the last 3 digits is indeed the color. As shown on this photo below... attached the brake caliper part numbers as well. Hard to say ? Interesting the CCB caliper right only is also for an 840i X drive lol. Maybe a typo or something not sure. Does the 840i have CCB option?

On the website it allows you to build one with the 19's with the CCBs option as well. I don't know if thats the case when you actually physically order the car from BMW or not. But looks like others have indeed fit the 19s over the CCBs.

[micvite]

Originally Posted by shawnhayes

The gap is damn sure different on mine, but much smaller than I originally remembered. Maybe 1/4" at least, maybe more.

Did you paint your calipers?

[micvite]

Originally Posted by jnotrom711

Couldn't tell you on the retro fit kit. But I can tell you, on a door panel the last 3 digits is indeed the color. As shown on this photo below... attached the brake caliper part numbers as well. Hard to say ? Interesting the CCB caliper right only is also for an 840i X drive lol. Maybe a typo or something not sure. Does the 840i have CCB option?

On the website it allows you to build one with the 19's with the CCBs option as well. I don't know if thats the case when you actually physically order the car from BMW or not. But looks like others have indeed fit the 19s over the CCBs.

Oh I believe you, I'm just saying I wasn't able to find part numbers for black and red calipers, so led me to think that it wasn't the case. Also considering the brake rotors are the same part number minus last 3.

As for the 19 in wheels it I mightve mixed up the packages lol its the competition package that removes the 19s not the ccbs, so yeah shouldn't be an issue fitting them in theory.

[shawnhayes]

Originally Posted by micvite

Did you paint your calipers?

No. Stock M5 CS caliper color. You have to pick the gold for the M5 CS if you want it. It doesn't match the rest of the car.

Shawn

[micvite]

Originally Posted by shawnhayes

No. Stock M5 CS caliper color. You have to pick the gold for the M5 CS if you want it. It doesn't match the rest of the car.

Shawn

Ah didn't know you had a cs lol

[micvite]

As of now I'm gonna give up on the brake caliper thing... according to this it's the same part for the m3s and m5s which certainly seems odd, but at least I found the different colors have completely different part numbers, but all things considered who knows how accurate any of this info is anymore