Quote:
Originally Posted by miamiten
Even though germancarfan is a troll, my statement wasn't brand biased. Any true car enthusiast who has seen the latest round of E63S spy vids at the Nordschleife would be nigh on impotent if they didn't get the fizzy feeling down below watching them. No doubt it's a monster and does handle quite well. It also will be quite a bit heavier. The C63S weighs as much as a 6cyl LWB 7 Series, the E43 as much as an 8cyl SWB 7 Series, and the new E63S will weight in the 4500 lb region. The F90 weight goal is quite a bit lower than that. It also will have some tricks up its sleeve. The current M5/E63S are fairly close and each one's benefit/detriment equal out most of the time.
Nordschleife times are the most manipulated times around and why BMW rarely makes the documentation public. There are 3 total configurations (Tourist, Manufacturer, and Race) and different speed restrictions depending on who the responsible party is for the car and the driver's license credentials. There isn't really a completely legal way to combine all of them and not violate a track restriction (Fines) while recording a time that isn't open for dispute.
AMS times are also very questionable in a way. They are the most consistent dude to Horst von Saurma as the driver, but he doesn't usually drive above 7-8/10's in the twisty bits.
The CTS-V Nordschleife "official" times are well known to be rigged through the use of performance enhancements (Pilot Sport Cup Tires, Magnesium wheels and UDM Wheels) and configurations made in the interest of "safety". Porsche did the same with the 918 by using a fixed roof prototype and de-contented interior. An F10 M5 with Competition Package and M Driver's Package, driven by one specific Factory Test Driver, with nothing but a more appropriate brake pad change on iron brakes, can complete a full lap in under 7:30. The other Factory Drivers can do it in the low 7:30 range.
Saying vehicle X is faster than vehicle Z all the time based off various recordings doesn't always work. Take the 918. One of the fastest production cars in the world. Yet it's slower on the Goodwood Hill Climb course than a Rolls Royce Wraith (which was within a few 10ths of a second behind the Bentley Continental GT3-R).
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Not commenting on, or getting into, the "Nurburgring lap time" debacle. But IMO there's a few inaccuracies in your post.
Horst Von Saurma doesn't do the Sport Auto Supertest lap times anymore, and haven't done for some time now. Christian Gebhardt has taken over HvS' duties as their Supertest editor and lap time driver.
There currently aren't any speed limits on the Nordschleife. Lap times and lap records are fully legal to set.
Further, during industry pool sessions, speed limits was lifted last year. Which is why the M4 GTS was able to set it's time in a fully public and legal manner. Also, Sport Auto was allowed to set some laps during industry pool sessions without speed limits last year (they wrote about it in the magazine).